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Okay, this is Jason. I'm doing a cold open. I'm real snacky. Those carbohydrates, they're crunchy, they're salty, they're not good for me, but man, it feels good. Doesn't it feel good, gang, to do a nice, crunchy, salty snack? Or do you like the gooey, sweet ones? I don't know. Maybe a combo of both is great, right? But which do you start with? Which do you end with? What do you put in between? I know what you put in between. You put in a nice, big, fat, well-cooked episode of Smartless. Nom, nom, nom, nom, nom, nom, nom, nom, nom. Welcome to Smartless.

Smartless. Smart. Less Smart

Less Fuck the stress You know guys I can't have The stress I I lost my voice And it's just now Come back A little bit I still have a little Brenda Are you screaming At people on set

Is it from the Knicks games Or is it Yeah screaming At people on set again I think it was It was a

It was a I want my chair over here. It was, I think it was a cold or it might have been allergies. No. I mean, yeah, it started. By yourself? It started, yeah. It started in my throat and it went to my nose and then it landed on my vocal cords. You're a little frazzled.

Jason's a little fragile. I feel like this is the first time we're meeting the real JB right now.

And I was a little frazzled getting to Mike today because that's what we call it, right? Getting to Mike. Getting to Mike. Sure, sure. Because I wanted to have my teeth brushed. for you. Do you guys brush your teeth for me? Of course, always. No, not me. You don't. Don't you brush. Oh, look at his teeth. Did you sleep with the whitener on too long last night? No, I went

to the dentist yesterday and he's like, I don't whiten my teeth.

How about that? And you smoke. And you drink coffee. I don't want to drink coffee. And you self-tan.

Don't self-tan. That's the one where don't make me mad. You and Kimmel, nobody loves hitting me my tan more than Molly what's self tan mean you just lays out that's like a cream

but where do you find the time and how is it always so even Mr. Trump

well you know you know what I do every day I do my walk every day and so that's like an hour

I don't talk to me like I'm fucking watching you doing your fucking heavy hands and shit you know what my roots are

your velcro ankle weights You know my routine.

Is it?

With my weight vest. Somebody took a picture of me with my weight vest yesterday on Loma Vi. Oh, really? I got to see that.

But, Will, I spend a lot of time.

time when i'm not working on the golf course as we're aware what that's that is that's that's five hours of sun exposure and i wear 100 so you're saying you're 20 minute i don't wear

okay that's what it is a and b i don't wear a bucket hat right right so you wear no sun

protection whatsoever you're kind of bragging about that right now to get yourself that nice color but you're giving yourself fucking cancer i'm not first of all fucking cool it it's early for me to die okay i've had i've had skin cancer already i had i had something shaved off my my my eye remember that you go in there and got it all scraped off i get i get checked i have a friend

of mine and she's been giving me a lot of shit about uh sunscreen lately is are these checks

that you pay for or is it um you say a friend like a like a close friend of mine and then does she check for ticks at the same time and all those tough to find spots

whoops found another one she just squeezes it out like a zit you're like you're covered in ticks

i found a couple of leeches too i'm like so they have to remove the poison

oh my gosh so wait so you've got you've got it yeah now you're getting into a sweat because you're thinking about all the possible risks you're taking i also i've also had four coffees

today so having a coffee sweat yeah you know uh we were at dinner uh the other night jb you were missed i know you were missed and and jen brought a photo up from our uh our big family trip from a few years back where we went with all the kids and everything yeah god i love that and there's a photo of of all of us and then my head sticking out the back remember how tan i was and my hair is sticking up and i've got zinc on my lips and i look like a crazy person right john

we passed around the photo and everybody had something to say about it

and I've never seen it before I was like what is I look like an insane person like you guys came to the island and found me there I'd written in the sand SOS

we have to go back there I know

it'd be fun to go now with the kids a little bit older

it's fun being back for the weekend it's very nice to be back for the weekend

I'm going to your Q&A tomorrow at Netflix because I know that you're doing a Q&A sesh.

Oh, is that right, eh? What the hell are you doing there?

Well, I'm just going to go because I want to ask you questions about directing and stuff. I know you're giving like a thing. And so I got an email from Netflix about it. Like, come join us. So I'm like, oh, I'm coming. Wear the zinc on your nose so that when you hold your hand up. I'm going to put a fake mustache and a hat and then I'm going to sit in the back

and I'm going to be like, I've got a question. No, you should play the crazy Italian guy from our podcast.

Yeah. I love a black and a rabbit. these brothers are crazy

you're unhinged I can't believe

they sent you an invite

no actually a different friend of mine got an email about it and they sent it to me and I was like oh fucking send me that I want to go I want to go show up and crash how good and then you know what I did have the thought I was like if I did it then I make it about me and I'm not going to go and do that no why do that

please please

I do it enough there's so many people listening right now who are nodding going like, I know, you do make it about, you shut up, we hate your stupid stories.

But what about, like, yeah, so I'm here this weekend to do these interviews and stuff for DTF and for Black Rabbit and stuff. And it's all talking. It's all talking. Including this podcast. And I was looking at, like, literally 36 hours ago, I couldn't, everything was like this. I couldn't make a set. Oh, really? And I was like, oh my god, I've got, like, five days of work ahead of me that's just talking. Luckily, I got a little prednisone in me and an anabolic.

Yeah, good, good. You know what? I was talking to our buddy who's doing Dog Day Afternoon. Not John Bernthal, but I was talking to you. You guys know John Ortiz is the best. He's a great actor, and he's a good buddy of mine. And he is on Broadway right now, and he has a really bad cold, and he's like, it's a nightmare scenario.

I almost called you, Sean, because I knew you'd probably have some fancy Broadway doctor that knows how to deal with vocal stuff.

Always. I have two of the best. I'll text you. Boots knows.

Wait, wait. Is that, wait, Sean, are you getting rid of paddles and going with boots? Right now he's boots.

Right now he's boots.

Oh, boots McGee. Yeah, boots.

Yeah, boot on. But speaking of some. Sean's got a point that he wants to make. I saw him. Who are you looking at off camera who's giving you the cue to go into it? Is it Scott? No, nobody. Me. It's me. Okay. I'm looking at all of you.

No, we have to go because our guest is super famous and she has to work. Oh, sorry. Here we go

I should have got dressed up I meanwhile got undressed Put your sleeves back on I'm gonna put a nice pashmina on

Oh guys My guest today Who I love and I live for Grew up in Castle Hill, New York The middle of three sisters In an apartment Andrew Martin So small

They all shared a bed There was always music in the house With constant reenactments of West Side Story I could do the whole thing with her But her parents still hoped she'd become a lawyer Instead, she left college to pursue dance full-time Left home and ended up sleeping in a Manhattan dance studio Somewhere along the way She taught Kerry Washington how to dance I can't wait to ask about that Then she became the first Latina actress ever Paid a million dollars for a movie role Rita Moreno Briefly been on this podcast before It's the beautiful, multi-talented, and unstoppable Jennifer Lopez. Jennifer Lopez. Yes!

No way. Willie got it.

Very nice.

It took you a few.

No, when you said briefly, and then I remember you briefly on yes.

I was so close with Andrea Martin. God damn it.

So close.

Oh, my God. Jen, what are you drinking? Hi there.

A little cappuccino.

Oh, nice. What do you go with for the milk on that? Are we almond? Are we dairy? I'm traditional.

You know, I like a 2% milk. I know everybody's with fancy oats and almonds and soy.

Cow milk all the way. Jason responds to that, you beta.

I know, but I feel, I got word from one of those doctors back in the day that I'm lactose intolerant or I'm bad with the dairy or something like that. And so I've just, I've never had like cow milk since then. Plus, I did see a documentary once where they said the very disgusting fact, which is humans are the only species that drink the milk of another animal. I don't care. That is weird, isn't it? It is weird. It is weird. I'm the same way. I don't care. I know. You drink full, tall glasses of milk, Sean. I don't care. I know. And it tastes so good. It tastes so good.

Plus, Jennifer Lopez is always working out and exercising and staying in good health so she can have milk in her coffee. I try. Right? Well, it's not about that. It's not about that. It's not a bad health choice. But I mean, you know, you have to, if you're going to do it, you kind of have to balance it, says... Jennifer Lopez, says Jennifer's Dr. Ding Dong over there.

You look very healthy.

You look very, very healthy. Dr. Ding Dong.

Thank you. Yeah.

Jen, thank you for doing this. I'm so excited you're here. This is a long time coming from me. You've been on my list since we started.

Oh, you're sweet.

Wow, this is exciting. It's true. And I know we kind of know each other, and I love you too. Yes, we do. Do you?

We dance together.

Yeah, we worked together many times over the years. Will and Grace. On the Will and Grace. And something else, too. I can't remember what it was.

Did we?

I think so.

You know what I realized? I'm so bad that, you know, you get to a point where you've done so much with so many people. And people are like, we did that. Like, the other day, don't hate me, I was watching Monster-in-Law.

Oh, my God.

And I forgot you were in it. You forgot? And I was like, what?

I'm going to do that podcast soon. That's what happens with him.

No, no, because it was just so long ago. I mean, I don't want to say how many years ago it was, but it was so long ago.

Wasn't that during Arrested Development, Willie? You did that? That was 21 years ago. It was the summer of 2005.

21 years ago. Wow.

You know, Jennifer, as I'm admiring your beautiful printer in the background there, I then noticed that, Sean, you've moved the award. Didn't you have an award behind you last week?

Yes, because you made fun of me. And I made fun of you moved it. Yeah, I did. But it's just right there, both of them.

But what about how... Jen keeps it real. She's got a fucking printer in her front. That's a biz hub. That's a biz hub.

I'm in a hotel. You are? Where? In New York? In New York. I was here for the upfront, so I'm just here.

No, but you know people like stack their awards behind them when they do Zooms? Yeah, I do. No, you don't.

But in my office at home, I have like a wall of all these awards and things. All behind you for the Zooms. They're just there, and then you sit at your desk, and they're there.

You've got so many. You can't point the camera. Where are you going to put them? Exactly.

Jason, where are you going to put them? In your office there? Or, yeah. By the way, they're in the basement now.

Will's looking behind him. He can't fit them in the whisper booth. I can't. There's not one.

There's not one. Why is it so dark in there? I know.

So that his tan pops. This is my booth. But hang on a second. He's getting a nice bounce off his teeth, though.

The shorts.

I know. The shorts.

Like, at what age do you start wearing shorts? First of all, look at these.

Oh, it's a hockey glove.

These are special Toronto Maple Leafs. limited Toronto Maple Leaf hockey glove.

When have the Toronto Maple Leafs ever had a green hockey glove?

It used to be the Toronto St. Pat's when they first started. And then look at this, Jason, do you remember this? I've somehow kept this after all these years.

What is it? Is that the Wanamaker from the PGA Championship?

It's called the VH1 Big in 04. And we got it. We went for arrested and somehow I've kept this stupid huge trophy.

Wait, so we got one trophy and you got to keep it?

Yeah, obviously everybody elected me because they were like, who's the most deserving?

Is VH1 still going?

I don't know.

Yeah, I think so. Hey, Jonathan, welcome to the show. Yeah, question for the guest, please, Sean.

No, not at all.

Gotta break in.

Let's just chit-chat.

Well, it's, you know, but it's the thing about, like, we worked together three times on Will and Grace. And the first time, God, did we laugh a lot. I mean, I was kicking you in, literally, physically kicking you in the ass.

Yeah.

Jumping in between your legs and, like, dancing like fools. It was ridiculously hilarious. And you were so game. And I think you're so game for so many things. And, you know, in researching.

Yeah, too many things sometimes.

No, no, no. But, you know, in doing all this research before today, you realize, oh, I don't really, I've never done a deep dive on you. We always have chit-chat and have a good time, you know. You never asked her anything important. You were just worried about yourself. That's right. I was always like, when's the next question about me? But so before we get into it, I just want to say I realized doing all this stuff, how rare your kind of drive is, your work ethic, the ambition, the discipline you've been doing at such a high level for decades.

I mean, have you seen her documentary? That documentary is just like, I think I had a chance to run into you after I saw it and said how much I love it. It's so impressive. I mean, not only just well-made, but the scope of it. I mean, your career is incredibly stacked. It's incredible. I mean, nonstop.

And this is another thing we'll talk about later, but the thing you do for women in general, whether you do it intentionally or not, I'm sure some of it is intentional, You make them feel empowered. You show them that talent and beauty and sexuality. You can have all that at any age, and you're fearless about all that. How aware of—are you aware of how much permission that gives people, or are you too busy working to even think about it?

I'll say this. When I was starting out, and I had just started doing, like, my clothing line. So I had been acting for a while and dancing and singing for a while, had my first records out and things like that. So this is, fuck, I don't know, 20 years ago. Yeah. And I was working with a few girls in my office who are like friends who I just hired, you know? And I remember saying, like, it was getting overwhelming. And I said, I just, this is so fucking much. Why am I doing this? And she goes, Jennifer, if you can't, and I probably had just went through some breakup and fucking everything had blown up in my face again. You know what I mean? And I was just like, I just don't know if I can go. And she goes, Jennifer, if you can't do it, none of us can do it. And when she said that to me, I never forgot it. And I thought to myself, oh, people look at me a certain way, especially girls, like women.

Yeah, good inspiration for sure.

And it gave me like a feeling of responsibility to do things right all the time.

A responsibility you like or didn't want?

I don't mind it because I am a hard worker and I do have discipline. Like I started running track when I was, you know, eight or nine years old and I was practicing every day. Like I always had kind of like an athlete's kind of drive and work ethic. That makes sense. So I, yeah, and I did track for a while, gymnastics, I played softball. Like I was very much an athlete before I fell in love with dancing. And once I fell in love with dancing, sports went out the window.

Right, because it is a sport.

It is a sport. And it was it was just an easy transition. But also because I grew up on musicals with my mom and all of that. And I love them so much. It was like I always wanted to sing and dance and act. But when it took its natural time, I really like left everything behind and just fell in love with that. But that really made me feel that that exchange stayed with me even all these years later, because it just made me feel like, like, don't fuck it up, like do the right things. People are watching you for whatever reason, maybe because I was, you know, Puerto Rican and from the Bronx and came from similar places where all these people, you know, people come from. You know, I wasn't like born in Hollywood and, you know, kind of that thing. And so there was a real, Jason, a real like idea in my mind of like, you have to do things right. Don't, don't fuck it up, you know?

And work for it.

Yeah.

Yeah. And, and do it, do it, like do the thing, like go for the, go for it.

Yeah. What was first for you? Was it an example of someone who was, um, just an incredible inspiration as far as their, um, their accomplishments? was that first or was it being inspired by seeing an incredible dancer or musician or actor or when you when you were a little girl what was the first thing that inspired you was it accomplishment or

was it a specific um talent no it was it was it was the arts like i

Thank you.

from when I was very little, I remember you bought up Rita Moreno and you bought up West Side Story right before us. You were trying to guess who I was. He always does. That's all he does. That's all he does. And it really was Rita Moreno for me. Oh, really? Really? Yes, yes.

I did want her to be my mom. Watching Electric Company, I said to my mother once when I was a tiny little kid, I said, I want her to be my mom.

Yes, who wouldn't? And she's so amazing. And the thing is, is like, I, my mom watched West Side Story in the theater when it first came out and she made us watch it every single year I don't even remember the first time I saw it three years old four years old fires but I do remember watching it on tv one thanksgiving because it came on once a year and thinking that's what I want to do I want to sing and dance and act I want to dance around I want to sing my mother was kind of that way as well and very kind of vivacious take over the room type of person and I and I wasn't like that I was more like my dad I I was more quiet and kind of like to myself. But that part I had, like I wanted to sing and dance and shake my ass too, you know, like my mom was doing.

Just imagine you dancing and singing around like the living room and stuff like that, like kids do. Because like that's when we have no fear and no sense of, you know.

Dance like nobody's watching, you mean?

Right, but then there's that moment we all hit when we're about, I don't know, 10, 11 or something like that, where you start to become aware of shame and embarrassment and what other people might be thinking. And there's that transition that it's almost a sad transition that you see kids go through where they become self-aware. But then, you know, you hope that they gather sort of coping skills to kind of have self-assuredness and to kind of push through that and have their confidence take over and to be able to push through that. Do you remember that moment where you stopped kind of dancing like no one was watching and you were aware people were watching and we're able to push through that?

I think this is what makes me a little different.

Yeah.

That, I was never, no, I was never afraid to make a fool of myself.

That's great.

Like, I was always just like, it's fine. I fell down. And maybe that was part of the athlete part too. You know what I mean? Like, it was just like, you're gonna, you know, make mistakes, you're gonna fall, you're gonna do the, like, I was ready, I'm like, get back, very scrappy.

Part of learning, part of success.

Yeah.

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foods market and now back to the show i was thinking about when you started and really started to sort of break through and i kind of want to get into what that was because i'm not sure i really know what that thing was i have questions about it thank you sean this is not your time i'd like to reclaim my time uh jennifer i wonder if you if you know like the moment when you broke through and you broke through on such a global level in such a way that is very very rare where everybody

in the world knows who you are and just bear with me that you that you have the moment where you were that kind of dawns on you the level of recognition and fame and then you as a person the gap of you catching up to that and being okay with that on that kind of a level do you remember that time was it a struggle kind of between you and it it was the worst it was honestly it was

the worst it was um i had just done selena yeah and the movie came out and i was still walking around you know hollywood like going on auditions like it was still that time yeah but it had just come out and i was walking down the street and for the first time somebody was like hey hey and they come running towards me and i thought the motherfucker's gonna mug me what the fuck is going on right now like I got really nervous you know and I was just you know like any woman in the world you know we're threatened by other so many things like we're so scared all the time in a weird way and I was just walking to the store from my apartment in LA and it was just so jarring to me and then I realized they were like I saw I saw you in whatever and I was like oh yeah I was like I But my thing was, like, I don't know you. Like, I don't know you. Like, what are you doing? Like, back up. Don't touch me. I was so scared. And I remember it dawning on me. I was like, oh, you're not anonymous anymore. Right. Your anonymity is gone.

Yeah.

And I think in my mind, I thought, you can't get that back. That's something that's lost forever. And I remember that's when I started having panic attacks.

Oh, did you?

I had, oh, it was a terrible time for me.

Yeah, can you talk about that when you were filming enough, right?

No, that was another time. That was when I overworked myself so bad. That was a different time. When I didn't realize my limits.

Yeah, but I read about that in preparation for this and that's fascinating to me because I love medical stories. Can you say what happened and why?

Yeah, so that was the kind of getting used to like fame and realizing your life had changed in a way that you couldn't control anymore or go back you can't go back yeah they're always gonna know somebody will always have seen selena and somebody will always and and for whatever reason that really freaked me out and and that took a minute but what you're talking about is when i was doing enough i think i had done like four movies in a row and i had recorded my second album

or something like that so the j-lo album which was really big yeah and huge and what was like

the jail the j-lo album right and i was working filming every day as you guys know what that is you know all the hours and then i would go into the studio at night and then on the weekends i like had junkets or video shoots or whatever and i remember not clocking that i had worked like 98 days in a row without taking a day off because we went back and counted it because we're like what happened and one day I'm sitting in the on the set of enough it's actually kind of thinking about it and I'm walking to the set every single time and every time I walk to the set I start getting a little like a little pitter-patter in my heart like it's like rising and I go and And finally, it got to the point, I was like, I really feel nervous. And I had the little girl in enough. And I was like, I'm sorry, sweetie. I feel a little weird today. I said, I'm a little tired or something. And she was like, it's okay. You're going to be all right. You know, she's like going like this to my face. But I wasn't all right. And I went back to the trailer and I sat down. And all of a sudden, like, I just couldn't see. Like, it was almost like I couldn't see clearly. Like something just went over my eyes and I couldn't move. And one of my girlfriends, who was my friend since the second grade, was my assistant. And she was like, so she has to know, like, she doesn't know what, she didn't really know what she was doing too much. But we love thugging it out together and figuring it out and being together. And I said to her, Arlene, I can't move. I can't see. She goes, stop it, Jennifer, you're scaring me. And I go, no, I really can't move. I said, no, I can't move. You should get somebody. And she's like, stop, stop. I said, get B.O.B., my security guard. And she got me. And I was like, I can't move. And I can't see. And I couldn't move. I was just paralyzed. And he picked me up and put me in the car. We went to the hospital.

Wow.

And it was crazy. And I said to the doctor, I said, am I going crazy? And he said, no. you're not crazy it's exhaustion yeah he's like you're you shut down i remember i remember speaking

monster i remember we were shooting a couple days like downtown somewhere and the level of attention i remember you having to drive to set and they had to put blinders on the thing for you to drive into and there were photographers on the roofs of the building across the street yeah and i remember And then they had a base camp set up in this parking lot downtown. And I remember these dudes randomly putting cameras under the fence and just shooting like this, hoping to get somebody. And I thought, oh, my God.

Yeah.

That is so – and by the way, there are a lot of people who go like, oh, well, that's the price you pay for fame and all that kind of bullshit. And you're like, oh, yeah, that's pretty rough, man. Like you don't have a second.

Yeah, it can be really tricky. And you learn to kind of like live a certain way. Like, I don't go out all that much, you know, and I, you know, know where I can go. Yeah, to this day. And I have my, like, very small group of friends, and they come over, or we do things, or we go on trips. But even when we go on trips, it's very curated, and you have to learn because it's just, it's part of it.

Jason calls photographers. He lets them know they have his schedule. They have access to his iCal.

They never show, and they never show. um what about uh now that sort of uh surgical masks are so sort of like accepted in in public and so commonplace now do you do you ever enjoy that level of you know sort of no i feel like

people always know it's me and i feel stupid like if i put on a hat like too long it's like is that j-lo yeah you know what i mean it's like stupid i put a mask on they'll even recognize my voice sometimes if i'm just talking in a store like i'll see people creep around the aisle like they heard me talking or something i'm like hi did your friends call you j-lo when you were a kid growing up no no not at all not at all um that was something that i always credit heavy d i don't know if you guys remember yeah he was a rapper back in the day and we all uh all the Sony artists, there was a place called the Hit Factory here in New York. And all of us recorded there. A lot of people recorded there. It was a big studio and we'd always, people would always come in and out, you know, to other people's studios. And I met Heavy at that time. And he was, he just always used to call me Jenny Lowe. He's like, J-Lo, J-Lo, Jenny Lowe. And I was like, I think I'm going to call my next album J-Lo. I love that. That's so cool. Yeah. And that's kind of how it happened it was really very simple it just stuck when did jenny from the block come well i was gonna get to jenny from the block yeah what was the next album so that j-lo was my second album my the first album was on the six and my third album was um this is me then and that had

jenny from the block on it do you know you spawned how many people in the world probably refer to their friends jennifer as jenny from the block like we have a friend oh my god right yeah you

You do come across it. But also they all do their names. Oh, my people call me Eido. Yeah, right, right, right. Like they put their name together and stuff like that.

Jason would be J-ba.

Yeah, you'd be J-B, J-ba.

And you're Siha.

Some Siha.

Sayha. Sayha.

It doesn't work. It doesn't work. It doesn't work. It doesn't roll off the tongue.

So, but getting back to when you were first starting, because I think it's fascinating that you went from the time frame of In Living Color, which was, you know, its own story, which we could probably talk about forever. But In Living Color to Money Train to Selena, at that time you really had to prove yourself as an actress and you probably worked hard to do that, right? What did that period feel like when you look back on it where you're like, wait, how do I get people to take me seriously from dancing on In Living Color to being an actress?

Well, it's funny. My very first movie was a movie called My Family, Mi Familia, which Greg Nava did. Oh, right. And it had Edward James Olmos in it. That was the very first time I worked with him. And I played the young matriarch in the movie. And right from that moment, I think people seeing that little piece of tape, that really helped make the transition. Because it was a great little role. and I had to like cross the river from Mexico into the thing and I'm like swimming and so I'm like I'm actiony and I'm crying with the baby and I'm like it was like a great little juicy it was a small role but it was juicy and with that piece of tape people were like oh she can act she's an actress and I was and I had worked on it before I did my first movie I studied it acting all throughout and Living Color really brought me out to Los Angeles and that's when I started like taking classes all the time.

and reading all the books and doing all the things. I love that.

You did, and then you did, God, I remember, this movie holds up. I love it so much. You're so great in Out of Sight. Oh, thank you. Oh, my gosh. Yeah, you were so, that movie is so good. So, so good. Francisco. Oh, you're so good in that. It's such a great movie. It really is. You really dragged Clooney along, you know, because, no, you did. You launched something there. You made Clooney look good, and I don't care if he hears this. You made him look good. And that Soderbergh character. And Soderbergh, too. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Steven, too. You really helped those guys.

Yeah, I really helped him out.

No, but talk about that movie, if you will, just a little bit. Because that was like a real, that movie like really went like, she knows what she's doing.

Yeah.

I mean, you already were, but.

Yeah, I was excited. Listen, I got really lucky in the beginning of my career to work with like some really great directors. Steven Soderbergh, Oliver Stone, Francis Ford Coppola. Like I was like, I worked with Robin Williams. It was a really beautiful, beautiful beginning to an acting career for me, for sure. Yeah, and working on Out of Sight, it was funny. The thing I remember the most about Out of Sight was one of the things that Steve's on, because we had one of the most epic nights ever singing musical theater. I think I was singing to him and telling him I was going to be a singer, and he was like, you're right i was like i am i am i'm working on my album right now like i was so young and kind of like goofy and whatever and he but i also remember like the auditioning process for that and going i remember the last like i read for steven and he was like i think i like these talking to george like i like this girl jennifer lopez to play this role and he was like okay and they had me go do like a chemistry read and i had to drive to george's house and i remember getting there and there was a pig in the front yard i was like this is some real hollywood shit this is some weird stuff and i got collecting the mail yeah he had his pig and we were there and we you know we read like on the couch together um literal casting couch and we were just had this chemistry that really worked and Stephen just loved it and I got the role and I was so happy because it was a really great role as well so did you get it there in the room or yeah I think yeah by the time I got home they had called uh my agent and said that you know they wanted me

that's great how do you with with with so much ability um across um you know mediums how and and and anything that you basically declare you're going to do it's going to find financing and it's going to find an audience how do you decide what to do if if if anything is a viable direction like i mean you could you could start a musical tomorrow or you could do another album or you You could finance, you could start a movie. You could act in that movie, direct that movie. You could open a bank. You could start like a cupcake store down the street.

I do have cookie dough that I call J-Dough. There you go. Oh, for real? That is the best chocolate cookies in the world. And one day I'm going to make this, I'm going to share it with the world because they're so good.

But you don't sell it yet?

No, no. That's a mistake.

We can announce it today. Leave the money on the table. I want it. We love chocolate chip cookies.

Truly, so how do you decide where to point your energy and your assets?

You know, it's funny you ask that question because I don't think, I think one of the things about my career and sometimes, you know, in any long career there's ups and downs, you swing for the fences and you, you know, fail. And then there's times when it's just like, you know, you just hit it out of the park. And right now, I think I just didn't ever realize that I had that kind of power. I always felt, again, like the scrappy one kind of trying to make it.

And erring on the side of humility and not assuming something till you're sure. I think that's a healthy place to be.

And it did serve me in certain ways. But in other ways, I always felt like whatever I got was good enough. Instead of going, wait a minute, is this the right thing to do right now? Or is that the right? It was just kind of like work, work, work, work, work, work, work. I'm working, I'm working, I'm working. And I think it wasn't just now as I'm, my kids are about to leave to college in about a few months. They're both 18. Don't make me cry, okay? Wow.

I'm with you.

Yeah, and they're twins, so they're both leaving at the same time. It's just going to be me by myself. And I'm looking at like what I really want to do. And for the first time in my life, I. I've really taken more control of exactly what you're saying. Like, what do you really want to do? Like, do you want to direct? Do you want to do musicals? What have you not done that really feels fulfilling to you? Because I actually have realized that I do have that, that I have earned that over these years. And I want to be very intentional about what I do over these next four or five years.

You can take agency over your own life.

Yeah, and also, like, give myself a pat on the back, which I never did. I never do, and I never did.

You should.

Where I go, you know what? You created this. That little girl with, like, I always say this, with, like, holes in her shoes in the Bronx. You know what I mean? I wear my sneakers down where this part of my foot was out all the time. I'm sure that's going to be a meme.

If I asked you right now, what do you really love and value most in your life? I'm sure that you would say your kids. But if I, if I, if I narrowed that to what your, what your career represents for you, what it just sort of in a pursuit of like trying to find an answer for what you would want to do next or your next chapter to be, what is it that you enjoy the most that you, that your career has provided you? Is it, is it respect? Is it, is it?

Endless possibility.

Yeah.

I think it's that I have opened up an avenue for myself where there's endless possibility. And I can really create a new dream right now for myself.

Yeah, for sure.

And I just moved into a new house. Like everything in my life has changed over the past couple of years. I moved into a new house. What happened?

I'm kidding.

I'm kidding. I'm kidding.

Oh, that's for another time.

It's a different podcast.

That's a different.

Right, right. Guys, keep rolling. Guys, keep rolling. Keep rolling.

You come over, we have a glass of wine, and you come to the new house, and it's amazing. And I built my little corner of the world dream house. I got my kids some horses. We have stables. Oh, that's great. I was like, please come home. Please come back home to your horses. There's horses here. And just really thinking about, with all this change, it's actually been a very emotional time for me. where, yes, I'm crying because they're leaving, but I'm also like staring down, like, what is my life now? The past 20 years, it's been one thing. The past five years has been a tumult, you know, and then the last two years has been kind of the healing process from that tumult where I really got to know myself. And the person I am today is so different than the person I was even two years ago. It's crazy. And now I can really look at my life, appreciate it for what it is and what I've created for myself and be really happy. And both my kids, like, got into all their colleges and they both got scholarships and they're going where they want to go. And it's just, I was like, you did that shit all by yourself.

That's great.

Like, you had very little help, you know?

We'll be right back. hey so uh you know we don't have to get into my specific uh sleep hygiene and uh you know everyone's got problems with when they sleep you know but let's just suffice it to say having the great mattress is helpful with a lot of these things it fixes a lot you need yourself a nice pillow too but really it's all about the mattress having a high quality mattress is so important because having a good night's rest sets you up for a great day. Helix, the most awarded mattress brand, has over 20 mattress models to choose from. I mean, you can even find cooling upgrades so you can get great rest on hot nights. Plus, Helix delivers your mattress right to your door with free shipping in the US. There's also a 120-night sleep trial and limited lifetime warranty. Now, I got myself the Dusk Luxe, and that seems to have me just, you know, slotted, I think, as the kids say. You know, I don't know what kids, but I think I heard it around town a little bit. And it seems to sound like what my experience is, because I'm happy. I get up in the morning, things are good. That Dusk Luxe is taking care of me. Now, how many years have I had my Helix mattress? Just mind your business, plenty, okay? What model is it? I told you, how has my sleep improved since you switched? Listen, that's out of range, but I'm happy and you could be happy too with a Dusk Lux. Just go to helixsleep.com slash smartlist for 20% off site-wide. That's helixsleep.com slash smartlist for 20% off site-wide. Make sure you enter our show name after checkout. so they know we sent you. HelixSleep.com slash smartless. Listener, are you running? Are you gunning? Are you maxing out your energy and just trying to figure out how to keep your tanks filled? Well, I'm with you. And for me, that usually means nourishment. Cliff Bar is an energy bar designed for sustained energy and fuel that you can reach for when running, hiking, riding, or pushing through workouts and longer days. Clif Bar delivers fast-acting and long-lasting energy to help fuel performance before and during activity. It is baked and tastes great. Made with organic rolled oats and includes 9 to 11 grams of protein, depending on the flavor. Clif Bar is built for active lifestyles and for people who challenge themselves. Raise your bar with Clif Bar.

at massage envy your me time is all about you try a relief massage to ease everyday aches and pains or a relaxation massage to truly unwind or treat your skin to a results-driven facial focused on a specific skin need like fine lines and blemishes uneven looking skin tone dullness whatever you need to look and feel your best. You'll find a service designed to help. I do love me a massage. I had one yesterday. Every time I get one, I go, why don't I do this more? Because I don't do it enough. And I have maybe a couple a year and I just go, what am I doing? I'm robbing myself of a really great experience. So book an appointment at massageenvy.com today. Each location is an independently owned and operated franchise. and back to the show. I was just going to say, I think it's awesome that you, the way that you talk about it, and you seem so sort of clear-headed and calm, knowing we sort of joke about it, about how much people perceive or think that they know about your life and what you've gone through and all that kind of stuff. You have to kind of put that in a weird place because people have this sort of thing that they think, but you have to actually go through it. And like you said, when you started, like, you're just a human being, and people forget that. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like, they, it's so, it's so crazy to me, because we don't really understand other people's experiences unless we walk in their shoes.

Right, and there's also, I think, I think, I don't want to cut you off, but I do think, you know, we're all, we're all aware of, and some of us are friends with, some people that have, like, this enormous level of celebrity and exposure that actually enables the ability for, enables them to stay exactly who that is for kind of as long as they want in other words there's this there's this real permissive culture around celebrity and you don't kind of have to be the best part of you and you don't have to grow like you know what you just said right jennifer that you know the the past two years has been about the healing and that you're you're you're you're you're so different now than you were even two years ago five years ago do you do you recognize that that's that that can be a real accomplishment for somebody in your position like i think that's a real great attaboy that you've clearly put in time and work and self-reflection and yeah you could have just kind of just kept eating the junk food of of the permissive culture around you and just kind of lean back but you're it sounds like you're leaning into who am i going to be for this next chapter yeah what have i learned etc etc 100 i i again

There's been different times where I felt like, whether people outside knew it or not, where I feel like my life blew up in my own face. And it was because of the choices I made, but also because of the fact that I had things that needed to change about myself that I didn't understand or recognize that was attracting certain things and attracting a certain type of, you know, experience into my life. And I really needed, honestly, it's that thing where, and you can go either way. You're right. It is a choice. So I want to give myself that credit too. But there comes a point where it's all so puzzling and wrong where you have to sit there. And after my last divorce, I just sat there and I was like, I canceled my Torah and I sat there and I was just like, you need to fucking figure yourself out. What is going on with you? Forget about everybody else. There's nobody to blame here except yourself in a certain way. Not that people don't behave in a way that's not great, but what are you doing? What do you have going on?

on and and that was that was a turning point for me and that was a couple of years ago now i had

the same thing about two three years ago i will i've maybe i've told you guys this and in private before but i had a moment before i got into real therapy a couple years ago where one day i was making coffee in the morning and i swear to god and i went i remember distinctly what was happening not the date oat milk and i remember and i and i went i said out loud to myself it's you right and i had this real i was like oh my god i need to do some work i go yeah but by the way

everybody needs to do that at some point in your life by the way everybody goes through this i mean it's all sort of relative it's part of the being human right being human is all have things that blow up we get these parents they do the best they can or they do as much as they can they form certain parts about ourselves. And then our journey is kind of the undoing and the healing of those things, of the patterns that that created. And so in doing and looking at those patterns, I was able to kind of like go back to that little girl and really look at her and go, that little seven-year-old girl, like I said, with the ripped nightgown, like I can see her right now with it. Like my hair was like up to here and it was about the same color. And you You know what I mean? 30 feet walking around barefoot all the fucking time. And I was like, you, you, yeah, just that. Still nothing's changed. Still Jenny from the block. And, and just kind of like going, you did this.

Yeah.

You did all this.

Yeah.

Give yourself a little fucking something, like a little love. Right. Stop looking for love in other things.

Yeah.

And give it to yourself.

Yeah, there's so much to love in you. Yeah, yeah.

Yeah, and you don't see it because you're in this business and everybody's telling you you're bad at this and you're bad at that and they're scrutinizing and criticizing your personal, your professional life and you're not doing this enough or you didn't choose that right movie or that song didn't do as good as last one. And you're like, and it plays on you and it plays on those places that were reinforced when you were younger of like whatever it is, the impressions that were made on you because of the way you were loved or cared for in different ways. And it's just, it's all so intertwined. And I find it very interesting and I love it because I really do believe people are capable of change because I've experienced it. Same, 100%.

And a lot of that fuel for change comes from that self-love. But that self-love is often so hard for all of us to kind of recognize and utilize because it's hard to see because we're living with ourselves every day. You know, you kind of get used to some of the things that you really should be taking a second to be pleased with about yourself. It's like you can't see your own hair grow, right? Like you see yourself every day.

I also think people don't understand what it is to love yourself, like to understand to whatever you want. And I think having kids for me changed a lot of that Because I realized whatever I want to give them, like, why wouldn't I give that to myself? Right.

Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Why don't I appreciate those things? Why don't I, you know, if you want respect from people, you have to respect yourself. Those are actions, right? Like, those are real tangible things. And being, my sister said to me once, Linda, who I think is so smart, and she was like, when are you going to be your own keeper? You keep everybody else. You take care of mom. You take care of me. You take care of the kids. you take care of everybody who works for you you take care when are you gonna be your own keeper and i was just like yeah and these are all little pieces i feel like the journey is like pieces pieces little puzzle pieces that you fit in little by little as you like sit there with the oat milk and go it's me yeah yeah this fucking thing that just happened me yeah right and you know you

mentioned the kids i i sort of realized also that like that act of the way that we love our kids for me anyway my experience is that act of being loving to them allows the reason it feels so good is because you're generating that and then you get it back and it's when you close off and you don't act in a loving way pushing i find the more i push out the more it comes back and so like with my kids that that's why it feels so good because you're creating that as opposed to kind of rolling up the window on it do you know what i mean i don't know no i i i agree and and the kids are

a great learner but relationships are great you know kind of learning grounds as well where you really get to face yourself and you get lucky enough to be with somebody who actually really cares and loves about you in the right way there's a lot you can learn from each other even if things don't work out you know what i mean Okay.

But Jason, I'm sorry I cut you off. I was just like, had to get that thought out.

No, no, I was kind of done. I was just saying, it's a dumb metaphor or analogy to not being able to recognize your own hair growing because we see ourselves in the mirror every single day. But if you don't see somebody for a few weeks, oh, your hair's gotten long. Your hair's gotten long. You have a beard. Yeah, right. You can't really see the things inside of you that you probably should be, you know. You've got the greatest hair of all time. I was trying to back into a compliment. Jason's got the greatest hair

You really do You really fucking do It's unbelievable You know what

Jennifer you want to know something He hasn't put a comb Or a brush in it Since he was 11 That's a true story Stop

Stop

And he doesn't color it He doesn't color it

Also true He's so handsome

Guys You know I mentioned it before Jen it's like You know The Maybe I didn't mention I think I mentioned In the intro Where you left home When you were really young And you slept In a dance studio Or something

I did.

As a girl.

I have done the craziest things.

I know, but don't you look back at that with everything we're talking about now and giving yourself and loving yourself, looking at that and going, wow, I was sleeping on the floor of a studio on my own, not even living at home. And look what I've done. Like, it's just mind-blowing.

It's crazy because my mom and dad, like, I was about to start college or I had just done a semester of college. And I was just like, I had a dream that I'm going to be in show business. And they were like, we lived in the Bronx. We, you know, they were like, this crazy bitch. And I was just like, no, dad. And my mom was like, you're not dropping out of college. You are crazy. You know how much we do so you can go to college. And my dad was like, did you have a dream? Really? I said, daddy, I did. I really did. Anyway, the next few months was tumultuous. And I wound up leaving the house. and I kept skipping, I stopped going to class at college and I was going to the dance studio and literally taking class all day. I just so fallen in love with it. I was, yeah, I wanted to be a lawyer. I worked in a law office for a few years during high school and I was like really good with numbers and taxes and things like that. And I don't know, I just could feel, I was just good at it and they loved me. and I just was on this track to be a lawyer and I was going to apply to law school, whatever, I don't know. Anyway.

Yeah, I mean, it's wild to know that, yeah.

Yeah, it didn't happen and I decided to like go sleep on the dance floor. I needed somewhere to go and me and my mom had a big falling out and I called the dance teacher and I said, you know, can I come stay, I'll sleep on the couch at the dance studio and he said, yeah.

Wow.

That's crazy.

He liked me, but yeah.

Do you still have a talent for numbers and bookkeeping and that types of thing? Like, are you involved with your, or do you just kind of just let, you just.

No, I'm smart about it, but I, and I've always been very attuned with my business managers, like not to let my money get away from me.

But you're not like playing the markets and like, you know, looking on the stock pages and like.

I do some investing. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.

because like some people I know they really like they handicap companies kind of like horses and they really follow that so they really get interested in that no I don't

I don't but and I left that behind and probably can you know do multiplication now my kids math is too hard for me when I try to help them but

you know what I just read the other day this should be good the keeping tree a page of a book they don't teach cursive anymore in school no I haven't done for like the last few years I know why is that Well, I guess because typing is such a big part of- I know, but like-

We don't write anymore.

But you got to sign your name and stuff. Exactly. Like, what is the signature?

They teach them their name in kindergarten, I think, and that's it. And that's it. We're done.

Next chapter. How's everybody's handwriting? Self-assessment on your handwriting go? Oh, it's terrible because you don't get to practice it, but I know how. Jason Badge, Sean.

My brain works faster than my hand, so I can't, you know.

I also want to have to write a birthday card. I'm like, it's horrendous. Wait a minute. Like, I have to crush it out. it's crazy

do you do all caps do you do all caps I do like a hybrid it's terrible

yeah me too it's a hybrid yeah what happens to us

I'll start every sentence in cursive and then end up going just for legibility alone I want people to understand what the hell I'm writing

it's so true

okay so this is like I'm gonna just because we're almost out of time with you speed round speed round so we're gonna do like a little tiny something speed round if you this is a section Sean's been trying to introduce to the podcast to your music career which is just massive and I know every other song that you've ever recorded and I just think it's incredible. I mean, what you've accomplished.

You know, it's pretty insane. I just had a number one dance record. Like a few weeks ago. Yes. Yeah, I had a new record out called Save Me Tonight. And I went and I performed it at Coachella. And after that, like went to number one.

That's amazing.

It's amazing.

It is amazing. Had you done Coachella before?

Never. It was my first time at Coachella.

Was it a freaky big experience or was it?

It's massive. It's big. And I had never been. I didn't know what it was like or whatever. But you have all these people. And I hadn't done a dance record in a long time, and David Guetta had this record, and I was going out on tour last summer to do like a little limited tour overseas, and I was like, I need some new songs. Like, I'm tired of performing the same whole songs. So I did like five new records.

By the way, we're not tired of those songs.

Thank you. I still do them. I still do them. But I did like five new records, three or four. Yeah, four or five new records. And I put them in the show just for that. And this one kind of popped off. And so we released it a couple months ago or something.

And what about videos? People still make videos, right?

They do. They do. But it's not the same. Yeah. I don't really even feel like I need to sometimes.

Do you have to pay for them?

I do. I do. Yeah, because it's different. Like when I started, they'd spend millions of dollars on videos, like a million dollars, two million dollars for big budget videos. You know, Michael Jackson used to do like seven million dollar videos. Right, I remember that. But now because of streaming and how the record business has changed since I started, it's like a whole different world. You have to shoot them on your iPhone yourself, a hundred thousand bucks. Sometimes they give you 75. It's really a different thing.

And that's to promote the album that you have a limit. Probably through social media too.

Yeah.

Right. And it's not even your album. It's the label's album. And the way the music industry runs nowadays, correct me, most of the income for the artist comes from touring as opposed to album sales. Is that right?

Absolutely.

Yeah. Now, speaking of touring, you've toured forever. You did obviously massive, massive shows your whole life. You know I love horrible theater stories. You might not know this. But give me something that happened on a tour that just went horribly wrong that's funny.

Well, I don't know if you saw this. Oh, yes, I know what you're going to say.

I know what you're going to say.

The thing on my neck. Did you see it?

No, I thought you were going to say when you fell.

No, that happened. But that wasn't on tour. That was on television. Oh, that's right. And it ran on CNN for the next three days. My fucking coccyx was fucking on fire. It was awful. But no, I was going to say this summer on tour.

I just wrote three jokes. Sorry, I'm not doing any of them. There's a coccyx on fire and we need to take pills for it and all that stuff. Never mind.

Yes. This summer when I was on tour, I don't remember where I was. Oh, God, which actual date it was. But I was there and I was, I might have been in Spain because I was singing a Spanish song. And it was like the slow moment in the show, you know. Although usually I'm dancing around and doing the choreography in like a fucking bikini and a G-string. Whipping my hair around and it's a good time. And so I'm standing there fully dressed and I have this thing on. It's like outfit on and I'm singing and it's really quiet. It's just a spotlight on me. And I don't know, like all during the show I was seeing like little bugs and things around. But, you know, we're outside. Oh, yes, I did see this. They're attracted to the light.

Yeah.

And so everything is dark except for me. And I'm singing, and as I'm singing, the audience starts screaming. And usually they do react in this moment because I stop, and it's a slow song, and they usually clap and whatever before I do the little last line. I do, like, a dramatic pause. Right. But this time they're, like, clapping a lot and screaming. And I was like, what's happening? And I'm just there, and this huge bug is just crawling up my neck. And I feel it. And I thought it was hitting me and going away and hitting me and going away. But when you see the thing, it starts like down here, and it just goes. And it lands up right here, and I just feel it a little bit. But I just stayed really still, and I finished the song, the last line, and then I just go and it flies into the light like that and I saw it and I was like what the fuck was that a fucking helicopter it looked like a helicopter it was crazy I love that but that was crazy but it was kind of horrible like if I would have known it was that I probably would have been screaming and yelling I know

okay three final little things

what's the most Bronx thing about you that's never left no matter where life is taking you

I can't stop cursing I try okay great

I love that I have a potty mouth it's terrible I love it and then by the way I'm telling you know this Jen already but I'm saying to Jason and Will did you guys know that Google Images is because of Jennifer Lopez what do you mean that Google didn't have Google Images until that green Versace dress and then everybody Googled it so then Google's like we don't have anywhere for people to see images a search engine a search engine So they invented Google Images because of Jennifer Lopez.

Isn't that wild? And Sergei has, you know, he's been asked that after that. He's like, yes, that is absolutely true. Jennifer, when she walked the red carpet in that dress, everybody wanted to have a picture of it, and we didn't have any Google search pics, anything. So we invented it.

Sue them, sue them. They're so rich.

I was like, don't I deserve some money for that?

For sure, for sure. We got some good lawyers.

Okay, and then we got to plug this because I can't wait to see it. Office Romance comes out June 5th on Netflix. It does. Yes, you, Brett Goldstein. He wrote it with you in mind, right? Yes, he did. Super funny, Brett Goldstein.

He's funny, but I love his brand, his brand of like writing where it's like really kind of hard jokes, but with this wholesomeness at the end of the day. It's just, it's really, I think you guys will like this one.

Okay, good. I can't wait to see it.

It's made for guys and girls, not just the romantic comedy for like girls.

And then this is really cool. Edward James Olmos, who was your dad in Selena, is your dad in this movie.

He is. And I got to tell you, when we filmed with him and he walks in on this, like, board meeting, and it's the first time you see him. And when he walks in, like, all the cast and all the extras that were in the board meeting were, like, you know, kind of like, he has such a commanding presence. But even more than that, when we screamed it for the first time and he walks in and his first line is, hot damn. Like that really deep voice. And people just started clapping in the theater. Wow. And I think part because he was my dad in Selena, of course, but also because it's just like, it's Edward James Olmos, you know? And it was great. It was great to get to work with him again. He's amazing.

And speaking of musicals, I love Kiss of the Spider-Woman. I can't believe it was your first movie musical ever. You need to do more. I know. And second of all, I read somewhere you're going to do Bye Bye Birdie, but that was a while ago.

That was a while ago. That was a while ago. Do you remember when they were doing, like, these musicals on TV? Oh, yeah.

Yeah, Carrie Underwood. NBC. Are you asking if Sean remembers? I did Hairspray Live with Ariana Grande.

That's right. That's right. So when they did those, they were talking about doing Bye Bye Birdie, but then it kind of went away.

Well, make it happen again.

I don't know. We'll see. You'd be great, Rosie. You'd be a great Rosie. I would be a great Rosie. Trust me, I practiced all the songs.

Well, they could change it to everything is J-Lo.

Yeah, they could. They could.

All right. Well, honey, thank you so much for being here.

You guys are great. Thank you so much.

It was very cool of you to do this, Jennifer. Thank you so much.

No, not at all. Ever since you did it that one day and I walked into the podcast, I was like, I've got to do that one day. It looks like so much fun. That's right.

That's right. Yeah, yeah, yeah. I'm sure you're off to go do something. What are you doing in New York?

I was doing the upfronts. Right now I'm editing. I'm working on an edit for the I just did a residency in Vegas and I did a new show a brand new show the J-Lo show which you would love because what I did was combine my hits with musical theater inspirations of mine I know it sounds like it wouldn't work but it worked amazing

wait but it's a residency

so we filmed it for Paramount Plus and for CBS and so I'm editing we're editing that now I can't wait to see that Yeah, we filmed it. I can't wait to see it. Yeah, that's going to be good. Very cool.

Busy as ever. Busy as ever.

Just doing my thing. Keep going. This is a singing, dancing show, girl.

It's really so impressive, Jennifer. It really is. Keep going. Thank you.

It's amazing.

You guys are so kind. Thank you. Yes.

We'll see you soon.

I'll see you soon.

Bye, bye, bye.

Bye.

Bye, honey.

That's a big star.

Sean, that is a massive, talented show. Come on.

when I was reading about her it's just, you go, oh yeah oh wait, yeah, oh wait

she's not a star, that's a megastar

that documentary is pretty stunning I mean it takes you all the way through it everything that she's done

who can do, who does everything

but it's also so incredibly well earned, it's not it's not because there's some sort of celebrity manipulation or something she's like, she does everything and does it at such a high level and people are, you know, paying for it and they're supporting it and they're coming, like, she's just... And she has this sort of, as I was saying, like this... sort of this coolness and this calmness and this, like, knows who she is clearly, right? And is, like, so comfortable. And again, I was kind of getting at that thing of, like, we all think that we know who people are. I remember watching, remember that Tiger Woods documentary came out a few years ago? Oh, so well. And it started, and I remember turning it off because I was thinking, like, I don't think he wants me to know all this stuff. Do you know what I mean? Oh, right, yeah, yeah, yeah. I just turned it off. I think Tiger Woods wants you to know all that stuff? But just anything about people just talking shit. Like, we don't know anything about it. Oh, I thought he was in it. I thought you were saying it. No, no, no. Until we hear from them what their experience is, we don't really know.

And she does seem so purposefully aware of her beginnings, of her roots, and is constantly staying in touch with the people that she surrounds herself with. Yeah. And so that's probably why she's so on it.

Shani, I mean, that was a great get.

oh great yeah and there's no way you would be you would be lazy um to work in the bye bye birdie thing at the end there of your questioning i didn't even he hadn't even thought about it no no plus i think you've used bye bye birdie before many times yeah we'll just wait we'll wait for something a little bit better yeah i know if you need a google search or something there's something that needs to come up you know what i mean that you

well the bye bye birdie thing is real because she she was i know what you know we know it's real but maybe if there was something

you can't set yourself up like that

no yeah you know what I mean there's got to be something typing and just trying to think

well you guys know

from her album This Is Me

sure yeah of course

you mean her 2002 record This Is Me yeah

this is me then and you guys know this is me now

you have a favorite song from that album

yeah it's so good it's called Never Good Oh, you sneaky son of a...

Bye, Bertie.

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