Muse

Uh, Alex is here buying some gifts for her baby. Oh, really? What's the name of that cutie? Lucian. Lucian? Yeah. You named your baby Lucian? I did, yes. That's my lizard's name. What a small world. He passed away recently. He was run over by an ice cream truck. Sad story.

TBTL!

I was just fixing to get me some grub. Beans. I love beans. Big, fat, hot, juicy beans. Now don't get me going on beans, or I'll be jabbering away till the sun comes up. Could you crawl back out of my mind?

Please understand that nothing personal is intended here against anybody. I don't hate these artists. I'm not trying to say that God hates them. And I'm certainly not trying to get you to hate them. I'm proud to be brainwashed. I've got a clean brain. You could eat off it.

I believe it was Benjamin Franklin who said, you have reached the end of your free trial membership at benjaminfranklinquotes.com. What a wise man. What's on the agenda, my friend-a?

All right, hello, good morning, and welcome, everyone, to a Monday edition of TVTL, the show that just might be too beautiful to live. A beautifully wrapped, glossy, sweet-smelling show. My name is Luke Burbank. I am your host.

I'd rather check myself before I wreck myself.

Coming to you from the Hollywood Broadcast Center right here in Portland, Oregon, where it is. Today it's a little cloudy, but I'm fine with that, honestly, because I was just in Palm Springs where it was like, and really Joshua Tree, actually. It was like 95 degrees. It was roasting.

I feel warm and I'm levitating.

So I'm okay with a little Northwest weather gloom for a few days. It's all supposed to be beautiful by the end of this week. So we might get up to like 80 or something on the weekend. It's going to be a fun day. Anyway, we've got a fun show in store for you here on this Monday. It's episode 3,929 in a collector's series.

Let the fun begin.

There is another lawsuit related to one of the songs that Marvin Gaye wrote accusing someone of ripping off part of the song. And I just would like to say to the estates and heirs of people who are associated with the creation of Marvin Gaye music, it might be time to just simmer down a little bit, Stu.

Simmer down, Stu.

We will play you both of the songs in question and see if your ears pick up something nefarious. Also, speaking of nefarious activities, or at least not super polite activities, there was a weird line in Matthew Perry's book. In fact, I think it showed up maybe a couple of places where he was being kind of rude to someone for no discernible reason.

I mean, it's so rude. I can't believe it. That's so damn rude.

And he is now apologizing. He says he's going to take that out of the subsequent printings of his book. So we will talk about that, plus emails and emails. And we'll talk to this guy. Oh, la la. The longest running cobro of the show may be best known for his depictions of the tall ships. He is Andrew Walsh, and he's joining me right now. Good morning, my friend.

Good morning, Luke. We have about one show's length to figure out whether or not we want to read an email that I just received at the end of the show today because I really enjoyed having Paula Poundstone on the show on Friday. Yeah, that was fun. That was such a fun time, and the story she told about accidentally insulting Alan Rickman and then ending up in his diary, which then ended up being published, and how he called her rude. Anyway, it was a great, great story. Did not disappoint Go back to Friday's show if you didn't hear it Skip to about the 50 minute mark Yeah that was the only

That was the only regrettable thing Was that we have this great interview With national treasure Paula Poundstone and then easily 40 minutes of the show was Is Shaquille O'Neal overly Rude to Charles Barkley on TNT basketball analysis

And did his mom shoot A shot over her head backwards Into a hoop in a Robitussin commercial from 1996. That was stuff people needed to hear. People were still kind of like, hey, we don't like guests. We just like hearing. I got an email or two from people who were like, we just like hearing you guys talk. About Friday's show? Yeah, and I was like, well, you know, we did a whole hour of content before we even got to the guest. I think we served the people who both like guests and dislike guests.

I feel like we gave our normal amount of prattle. and then we also had somebody odd who's a genuinely funny entertaining person like i feel like that was there was something for something for everyone i get it though i think

you know i listen to my podcast and i like it when they stay kind of basically in their lane and we're making a lot of jokes about having a lot more guests on or something

and trying to be a better, more professional podcast. I'm guessing that's where it came from. I don't want to be too harsh on the people who are just kind of like, hey, I love you guys. No, it's all love. Yeah, exactly. But anyway, I'm the one who brought that up. All of that is to say, Luke, in this story, if you haven't heard Friday's episode, I recommend it. But in the story, Paula Poundstone keeps referring to the fact that she was sitting at this table at this restaurant with a very famous actress, right? But she wouldn't tell us who it was. It became a spoof. You guys kept joking around about who it might be. But she kept that private. Well, I got an email just moments ago from a listener who said, well, listen, I just did some research. And, like, she tells the story in a book. And I think she identifies in the book who this star is. And so I'm not going to read it right now. We'll sweep the quarter hour. We'll see if we can get people to stick around.

Oh, man, that's a hell of a forward pro. I may even listen to the end of the show.

I doubt it. But my question for you is, like, are we I mean, I guess the fact is, like you said, Paula probably won't even hear it one way or another. She she doesn't take herself that seriously that I think for us to read this would be upsetting to her. But would we be breaking any kind of unsaid code between us and a guest who made a a very concerted effort not to name who she was at dinner with for us to then name it, even though it's already out there in the public somewhere?

I am wondering if – well, so it's in a book, though.

It has been published. According to this listener, he got the information from an actual book that has been published.

Okay, that makes me feel like it's fair game. And I think had I pressed Paula and said, can you identify the person, she would have said, sure. I think she's, you know, she's freewheeling. She's in the moment. She's feeling the slow. The game slows down for her. I mean, she's feeling the flow. In other words, I don't think that that was I don't get the sense that was some hard and fast decision Around anonymity I think it was just how she was feeling in that moment And if it's been published elsewhere in a book I feel comfortable Having a listener email us something that was in a book Plus, I'm just dying to know

Yeah, and it's interesting too It also cleans up some timeline issues that we had Because I remember Paula mentioned She said she didn't know what year this all happened But then at one point

So if it was Mamie Van Doren We know we're talking the 1940s

But at one point in the conversation, she throws out like, oh, maybe it was 2017, which that seemed wrong to me in the moment. I looked it up later. Alan Rickman had already parted ways with this mortal coil in 2016. So it definitely was in 2017. From a broken heart. From a broken, longing, yearning heart for Paula Poundstone. People constantly asking him, who are you? Yes. And also for the love that could never be with Paula Poundstone, as she would tell it. So anyway, so yeah, I think it's a good email. We will save it for the end of the show, and I will run it by our new lawyers and make sure that they're all cool with this.

Have we talked to our legal team of Danny, Danny and Danny LLC about if they are going to be able to continue working for the show when we are independent, which starts, by the way, July 3rd.

It's my understanding that they will be retained. Yes, that is my understanding.

Yep. OK, great. That's really good to know because I plan on us having a lot of legal entanglements, and we don't have the long arm of APM anymore protecting us. We don't have their legal backing, and so we definitely got to have our Dannys.

Again, and not to over-forward promote what's coming up on the show today, but I am going to say some things, Luke, that are so legally dubious. I mean so legally dubious. I might find myself with Don Lemon and Tucker Carlson by the end of the show. Yes, and by the way.

Oh, that's for some topical references from old Andy. Love it. And when you do utter those regrettable, possibly libelous things. Actually, let's see. Wait. Slanderous things. It's slander when it's spoken. It's libel when it's written. This will be the reaction, I believe, from the listener.

Oh!

All right. For some reason that bad, it's sort of bad. Almost there. 20 more seconds. Gotta get a lawyer. Eight more seconds. Hey, that's, I mean, we don't have anything to say about it, but boy, what a banner day for America. Tucker Carlson is no longer, will no longer be on that blowtorch poisoning the minds of American grandparents. Now, someone else will slip in there and continue to try to poison the minds. But it does it's it's a it's it's very rewarding when you see somebody like that fall, whether it's Bill O'Reilly or this guy, Tucker Carlson.

It was I haven't I haven't read the actual stories. I just saw the breaking news headlines for both of those this morning. But it made me think yesterday I was doing my regular podcast listening and my podcast listening gets weird on Sundays because I'm all out of the Levitard show stuff. That's all dried up. I finished that on like Friday or Saturday or something. and I I'm waiting for a new comedy Bang Bang to drop on Sundays usually, and that hasn't dropped yet. So then I start I start dipping into my kind of casual, fun, quasi newsier stuff like I'll listen to on the media and oh, God, what's off the media and off on the media and off the media. No, what's the most famous Politico Politico show podcast? I'm thinking of the other one with all the guys. Oh, God. Oh, it's a media. geez louise i don't think of it anyway it's weird because isn't one of the guys involved that name

john favreau but it's not the john favreau from from movies and television yes exactly it's

ridiculous pod save america of course i mean it's one of literally the most famous podcasts in america right now so you know i mean second to i guess us in the probably tbtl yeah uh nobody listens to paula poundstone um but anyway uh both of them and this doesn't often happen um but both of them were kind of talking about the the fox case the defamation case that ended up being settled and um they they both of these shows ended up hitting on a lot of the same beats um and both shows i believe had some sort of guest on or some sort of commentary saying that like chances are you won't see any kind of programming fallout from this you might see fox starting to be a little bit more careful if they actually are putting a specific business or organization or individual in the target like they might change they're not going to change their content anybody who might think hey listen this was almost a billion dollars out of their pocket to settle this case like they're going to be more careful and they're going to become a more newsy organization that's more responsible like i don't think anybody really expected that to happen but basically both of these shows or commentators were saying like yeah kind of you can dismiss that notion but they'll be just a little bit more careful about things they can actually get sued for like like we are not going to do um and then i wake up and i i don't know have you read anything about like direct correlation between everything that was exposed in this lead up to the settlement i

mean they have to be connected right i have been reaching out to some folks that i know in very at various uh levels of this kind of business i mean really i have been texting some folks this morning and the consensus seems to be nobody knows uh it's probably not the um dominion stuff because that was settled that's kind of in the rear view might not have been super great for him to be on the record saying he what was the i forget the exact wording but it was like he deeply hates donald trump which it's an amazing world where you can have that all that stuff exposed like i deeply hate the man and then trump is he flies to mar-a-lago a week later and interviews him sitting there like how do you do that you know i mean there's the obvious like well they have no soul but i mean just on a kind of interpersonal level how do you like imagine you found an email that said that i just like deeply loathed you and then we're like but we're just gonna well you know that's just something i said let's just keep rolling with the show like i'm even by trump's craven standards i'm surprised that he agreed to do the interview after he knows this guy loathes

him i didn't realize that i didn't realize that that was the timeline of things that the stuff had been already public before an interview well yeah because that was all coming out in the

dominion stuff so they were able to um you know get a bunch of discovery that were these text messages between various fox hosts and producers there's just one point where they're talking about something and the producer is saying um you know it's looking like this or whatever and then the i think it might be carlson somebody or somebody says what's your source and they kind of go lol it's the new york times because even they understand that the new york times is actually good journalism as much as they want to rail against it on the air that's what their producers are looking at to you know find stories and things so just kind of pulling i'll just use this analogy picking the rock up and seeing all of the little creepy crawly bugs underneath it kind of what happened in the discovery process of that thing but that being said they settled it that's a eye-watering amount of money for any normal person or company but for Fox and for the Murdochs that's a that's a sustainable loss um so I don't think it's from that uh who knows what it's from but uh it's to me what it the reason it's good is even though they're gonna throw you know some Judge Genie Piro type or whomever in that spot and they're gonna be saying the same crap carlson for all of his failings uh morally had a connection with those viewers and was good at like that was a highly rated time slot for fox if i understand right and he was a good communicator of that terrible brain poison so i like the idea of a rotating cast of people who are at least 10 less good at the communication of it because then it means each day there's 10 less brain poison going into people if they have 10 fewer viewers yeah and somebody pointed out i think this was

on the media, which honestly I'm getting so close to just playing that episode and just taking the day off myself. Listeners can just

enjoy it in our feed but um actually what you do is you feed it into a chat program and then have it yes here this is what i want to sound like on tbtl uh brooke gladstone and then just have it

basically voice your part of the show somebody did send an email somebody um who works in ai fed in it wasn't voice samples but writing samples of both you and i and then asked the chat bot to then write something in our voices and it i can share that with you later in the show too it's interesting um that's buried somewhere i'll have to find it but um it's interesting to see that it really does when you know how to use the technology how strong it can be and how much it can match like tone like that because i've just used chat gpt on such a just a surface level that it seems like i am talking like a robot but clearly if you know how to use it a little bit better like it can actually output things i have just been thinking about you want

If I might, just quickly, if you want to hear a great conversation on essentially AI technology and what it might mean for us, listen to Chris Hayes' most recent Why Is This Happening podcast, where he talks to a professor at Annenberg. I forget her name off the top of my head, but she is extremely smart on this stuff. And by the way, casual mention in the show, Chris just sort of casually drops that he studied computer science in undergrad. Oh. Oh, it's like, really that we're going to throw that on the list. Do you play football? The guy's got a guy's got a really good post game at basketball, like can play basketball, is brilliantly smart. So, you know, entertaining, a fun follow on various places can kill it at karaoke. And then we're going to throw in also dabbled in computer programming at Brown.

Oh, throw in throw in some shirtless photos of the beach this weekend on his Instagram. Are you kidding me?

so anyway um but but it's a very very good it they described they kind of put some stuff in context and helped people with let's just say smaller brains like me understand some concepts about what it is and isn't and where it might be going that i had really not understood the way

that i understand it now having so okay i started a thought a while ago about the dominion stuff that i don't feel like finishing i'm just going to follow this thread now um the uh this is something i've been thinking about lately as i open up the paper or open up the website of the paper i happen to be reading and there's always a headline about ai there was a story that you and i i don't think we'll probably have time for today related to ai i won't blow that one in case we want to talk about it tomorrow um the headline on the seattle times today is something about like why banning ai in classrooms won't help seattle area teachers etc like it just seems like every single day there is another headline about ai and having lived through the um well i guess technically the birth but certainly the blooming of the internet and all kinds of other technology that followed in our lives as kind of related to that i can't think of a comparison or another example of something that just seemed to blow up like this overnight like i know that we've been talking about ai for a long time i mean for for decades and generations if you want to go to sci-fi writers and whatnot um and you know there every now and then an ai story would break through the headlines and you and i would talk about it on this show but it really seems like in the past four months we went from oh the occasional story about ai to almost well that was my cat jumping down from the windowsill landing on my shoulder and startling me for a moment um but it seems like now it's just like every single day there's something about like how to be ready for the new world that ai is presenting i just i can't think of something that is just like blown up so quickly and doesn't seem overblown to me i mean not that i'm the arbiter of these things but like it i've it is right there for us all to play with i mean i don't know if you've been listening to

any of the music you know drake and the weekend i have i was gonna play something for you actually

can i yeah is it the drake and the weekend or is this the the in paris song this is the kanye one

Have you heard this? And I know Kanye is sort of persona non grata on the show, but this isn't Kanye. This is an AI program.

Is this the Tupac and Biggie redoing in Paris? No, it's not. Oh, that's one I've been listening to.

This is just what this person said. I asked AI to use all the current news and gossip about Kanye West in a song, but in the style of 2007 graduation album. Now, this does, I think, have a couple of swears or a couple of words that we wouldn't say on the show. But can I just play a little bit of this for you? again i haven't heard the i've heard about the other ones i heard about the drake one i haven't listened to it this song and i watched it on tiktok so it had the words also you know on the screen maybe that helped me follow it but the idea that this is a song that an ai program created that was not created by kanye is shocking to me because it's very clever

graduation type Kanye West on let go we do this for the shot this ain't the new Kanye this ain't the old Kanye now everybody know this the clone Kanye why am I the chick trombone Kanye I'm trying to go to Paris Paul A. Boon Fosse I told Kim stop fucking up my life why you trying to dress her daughter up as ice spice why you not trying to live your life by Christ sociable But I come from the shy shot

I mean, like, that's a solid piece of writing Yeah, yeah Like, so to your point, I guess, I'm sorry I agree it's not overblown Like, typically speaking, when something moves into the zeitgeist in this way And is constantly being reported on and over-described and everything It's usually kind of sort of overdone This does, I mean, one of the things I was saying on Chris's show was that because these programs now what's really happened and this is where i'm already getting on the edge of my ability to say things that are meaningful on the program but like it's a pro it's instead of having to know how to do programming you can now tell one of these ai programs hey can you go write me a program that does this can you go write me a program that does x y and z and then it goes and does it you don't have to go in there necessarily with your um you know your coding abilities and actually write the program you can just tell the program to go write you a different program and that alone chris was saying on his show is a absolutely quantum leap just

that kidding i hadn't even thought of that i have programs i want to write i seriously was i was

driving in the middle of the desert listening to the show uh back and forth from joshua tree and all i was thinking was i gotta write me a program about how to make some money yeah like i was trying to think of programs i want to write now that apparently even dinguses can do it yeah i

I want to write myself a program that gets me out of jail after the just terribly slanderous things I'm going to be saying in the B block of today's show.

Oh, look at you throwing around television terminology. Speaking of Joshua Tree, I had a really fun, interesting couple days in Palm Springs on Friday and Saturday chasing tumbleweeds and hanging out with an artist who makes chandeliers out of these tumbleweeds. And as part of the trip we went to this place Called Rimrock Ranch Which is in basically Pioneertown, California Did you ever get out to Pioneertown When you and Veeves were living in L.A.? No You familiar with it at all? I don't think so It was built as a set Like a western set for movies I think Gene Autry used to film out there And do things So it's this little kind of western This little western town That's kind of near Joshua Tree But now it's become like Super duper popular There's a kind of foundational bar They're called Pappy and Harriet's I guess our listeners probably know this I didn't realize At one time Paul McCartney decided to play Pappy and Harriet's Now Pappy and Harriet's is just a saloon, right? Like they have a little concert Like a stage area I'm guessing it holds a few hundred people Paul McCartney decides to play an unannounced show At Pappy and Harriet's, the legend goes But then he also had an entire replica Of Pappy and Harriet's built in a warehouse In LA so he could practice playing at Pappy and Harry's before he went out there. Wow. Which is like weird, honestly. Like, wow, that's a lot. Like, either just go play or, I mean, you had a whole, what's the, a synecdoche of it built so that you could be ready for it, like when you went there?

Yeah, it almost, I don't want to, like, this is the first I'm hearing of it, so I don't have strong opinions and I don't want to mislabel what's going on here, but it feels like there's an irony there. Like, I'm not sure if I remember, But just like this idea of playing a place that is like really, really low key and not the type of rights that you'd usually play when you're like one of the world's biggest rock and roll stars or whatever. So you're just like, I'm going to do something really down home and authentic. But in order to do that, I'm going to have to have this place created on a soundstage first.

But let me mention, too, that I got that. That news came in from, I think, our sound guy, Don, who let's just say Don loves a good story. I don't know I need to verify that myself before I officially Well I guess I already did say it on the show But I want to add the caveat That I don't know I haven't verified that myself But that being said yeah It does seem to kind of violate the whole spirit Of just going to play like a down home show I thought I got a pretty good joke off When we were talking about this Somebody said he charged $15 a ticket I was like well he lost money on that show I thought that was a decent spoof

I'm sorry I don't get it

Well because of course he lost money on the show Of course he's not playing Pappy and Harry To make money The idea that like Someone was like how much was it per ticket And they were like it was $15 a ticket At that point I wonder why you're even charging $15 Yeah that's not covering the set Of the fake Pappy and Harry You're Synecdody. No, not at all. But, you know, I guess maybe that was a lame joke because I got the exact same reaction from everybody when we were filming. So I think that might be that might that might indicate that joke is not as funny as I thought it was.

So you're going to tell you another joke I heard the other day. OK, yeah.

I'll try to do I'll try to do this really quickly. This I feel like is a very polarizing joke. And I've never tried to tell before I heard someone telling it. And I don't know if you'll if this will work or not. But here we go. i'll do the fast version this guy comes into a bar and his head is like half of an orange that's what he has for a head and he's got all this money coming out of his pockets and he sits out the bar and he orders a drink and his money is falling out of his pockets and the bartender's like your money's falling on the floor he's like oh that's all right there's more where that came from and the bartender after a while says i don't want to be rude but i'm just kind of curious like what's going on with your head is like half of an orange and he goes well i was walking down the street one day and i saw this junk pile and in the junk pile there was a a um a lamp and i rubbed it had a genie in there and the genie you know gave me three wishes but said be very careful because there are ramifications of these wishes and so the guy said okay well first i would like money to just always be coming out of my pockets i just want my pockets to fill with money all the time and the genie was like okay done and um then he said okay i also would like a huge mansion With this beautiful pool And all the stuff that goes with it Genie said, done Snapped his fingers, the guy has the mansion And the genie goes, one more wish And remember, you have to be very careful with this Because this is permanent And he goes, yeah, let me go get a cup of coffee and think about it So he goes, he thinks he comes back And he says to the genie You know, I've always wanted to have a head like half of an orange

I wondered if that was where I was going I was going to tell you If that joke ended up making more sense I was going to tell you It also would be funny if he just said, you know, I want half an orange for a head. Am I joking? That's what I was thinking. That's the joke. That's the joke. I was hoping that's where it was going.

Yeah, the buildup is really where it's at, I guess, for me on that one. So, yeah. So I went to this place, Rimrock Ranch, and it is unbelievably beautiful. I mean, just one of the more beautiful places I've ever been, and it's just like they have these amazing cabins, and you can have weddings out there, and the couple that owns it are just super cool. I was like, I was doing that thing, Andrew. I started thinking, do I live in the desert now? Am I going to just, will I just, will I walk away from everything I've known? And just, and then I thought, you know what? This is not even the warm season yet. And I was melting in the sun. So I was like, no, I think I'll just visit.

Yeah, I think the first time we visited that area was in the off season because it was like the peak of heat. It was the first time I'd been someplace where it was starting to close down because the hot season was beginning as opposed to the cold season. Yeah, that was my first take.

Yeah, it's beautiful out there. Although I will say this. One day we were on this Bureau of Land Management land near Joshua Tree and we were just walking this very arid but very beautiful kind of natural environment and finding these tumbleweeds. Which, did you know, and I bet you didn't because I didn't, the tumbleweed is basically a Russian thistle. That's the plant when it's growing out of the ground. And it's some kind of – it's crossbred with something else at this point. But it's basically a Russian thistle. And then eventually it gets You know the rain comes And softens up the soil then the wind blows And then it comes out of the ground And a tumbleweed is not like it doesn't grow in a circle It doesn't grow like that shape That is the result of it tumbling down the road Or the prairie or the whatever But the Russian thistle Came over to America they think In the like blankets and clothing And things of Russian immigrants Who had come to the US And then were taking the wagon trains west And at some point That Russian thistle that had tagged along with them Fell on the ground and started growing And that's what is basically tumbleweeds

And McCarthyism didn't root that out Hey Wait am I talking about Paul McCarthy That's McCartneyism The slow spread of McCartneyism I started a thought that wasn't really the show I'm sorry I started a thought that wasn't really even worth sharing And then I halted myself to make it Even more confusing in the middle of it So that's what I'm bringing

I still think the spread of McCartneyism is a decent show title At long last, have you no shame That's right Anyway, I'm back It really did reset, by the way, my whole clock on this weather I know I start most shows by talking about the weather and complaining Because we've just been so miserable around here But when I left for Palm Springs It had rained for, I don't know, 40 days and 40 nights or something here in Portland and there was something incredibly almost like emotionally important for me to get to stand somewhere and this is massive privilege on my part that I have a job CBS TV where they're like we'll we'll send you to Palm Springs look for tumbleweeds you know like so that's lucky for me but just standing in the sun and getting the sun radiating on me it emotionally reset me to where when i got back today or last night and i looked around i was like okay i can handle this thing i can i can settle back in for another couple of weeks of rain if i have to i don't know

what's going on in portland this week but i know a lot of seattle lights are very excited because it looks like the the weather is finally going to break in the right way for seattle lights this week today is like supposedly for a while the last sort of overcast day before things get uh sunnier and warmer building up to a very very nice weekend which means uh it's uh project time for old andy and veeves oh yeah yeah doers are gonna get more done doers getting more done i think i mentioned this to you the other day that like this uh back you're actually one of the few people who can actually picture this but the the back door we have that goes into our basement there's some outside stairs into a little stairwell and then and then a door to the outside right outside my office here and it's covered in some like um plastic corrugated roofing and that very simple stuff uh that's kind of in a wave pattern and it's like it's full of moss and it's breaking apart and it's just generally the whole area is very gross so we're uh we've been working on this for a while we already bought this stuff genevieve cut it into pieces it's weird it's like the wavy lines kind of go in the wrong way for what we need if that makes sense you'd think like you have these wavy lines that should sort of like help the water rivule it which i don't think is a verb uh you know kind of flow in the right direction but our our little awning area is sort of long in the wrong direction so instead of just buying a piece of this and laying it down we had to buy a piece of it and then Genevieve had to chop it up into pieces so that we can then install it um but we're going from a this isn't very interesting i just heard it but i'll finish

up quickly no no no no andrew listen you're talking to the right maybe the listeners are not interested but you're talking to the right co-host this is i'm this is i live for this stuff

Well, the stuff that we have up there now, like I say, it's really, really old and literally falling apart and broken. It's one of the more grotty parts of our house right now. It's not a super important or visible part, but it bothers me. But it was like this just kind of white, somewhat translucent stuff so that if you're standing under it and you look up, you can see all the moss growing on. It's a small area, but either way. And the paint was chipping and some renters used to live here stuck stickers of like stars. I don't know what kind of a hippie lived here before. I can still see the glue outline where somebody hung up letters that say namaste along the side of my door on this wood paneling. That's why I stare out while I talk to you. Anyway, so the point is, like, we pulled all those off. We did one coat of paint. Genevieve did all of this. When I say we, I just mean I picked the right lady.

I have to say, though, I love the division of labor in your family. I love that you really enjoy cleaning and dealing with stuff like that, and it's not Vives' favorite, if I understand right. And so you tend to sort of handle that. Veeves really loves booking travel and figuring things like that out. And also, she's a doer who likes to get more done. So she likes, you know, home improving and stuff. And it just feels like you guys have a good system where you both kind of lean into the stuff that you naturally dig.

Yeah, I'm a snoozer who likes to get things snun. In other words, I don't dedicate some. You snozzed. And you just lost. Look what I lost. But anyway, so here's what we're going to do. we're not like making we're not like taking this stuff off and making it super nice or fancier building like a proper awning we are just going to like kind of peel off the old stuff and replace it with new stuff we're still going to be using this kind of plastic this corrugated plastic sheeting for the roof but instead of that um ugly just like colorless bland bland sort of looking stuff we got that and it was hard to find but i got the green stuff i it's sorry my cat's messing with my microphone here, but like we're going to repaint everything nice and white and then this green corrugated plastic on top of it is just going to remind me, it kind of gives me a cozy feeling to think about. It reminds me of like what one of my Chutch's houses would have looked like in West Virginia in the 80s or something like that, you know, just like nice and clean with bright green on a freshly painted white post. I think it'll be okay. Nice.

Yes. Is that the plan for this weekend then?

Yeah, I think so. I think on Saturday we should be able to knock that out on Saturday. Again, Genevieve already did most of the hard work. It's funny. Here's the one thing I'll say that maybe is universal to the people who actually do this stuff. And I think that you certainly will appreciate this now, given everything that you've been doing and building, essentially rebuilding your property, is when I start a project, whether it's something related to the bathroom sort of remodeling, for lack of a better word, that we did or even this project here, you realize how everything has a system already things are standardized in a way that i didn't quite realize let me put it this way um we're veves and i are pulling out the little hex screws that have these little washers that are half rubber half metal on them from this corrugated this old corrugated plastic right Thank you. And we're pulling it out and we're thinking, OK, we should look for more of these things. And we couldn't we couldn't quite find the washers that look like they replicated these. And these is like, you know, I don't know if I want to use these hex screws anyway. I want to get something that works with the adapter on my drill anyway. Something just like let's just use a regular let's just use a regular wood screw. Well, we're looking around for that. We go into Ace. It's the place with the helpful hardware folks. And boy, is it really? I'm not even joking. You go in there, you go into Home Depot or Lowe's, you may or may not get somebody who can help you, but chances are not. At Ace, they really are just standing around waiting to help you with your project. And they know where everything is. And they know where everything is. And the guy, we're in there looking at screws, and Genevieve is like, you know, just like rattling through some drawer. And this guy comes up to us a few weeks ago, you know, a red vest. And he's like, hey, what are you working on? How can I help? And we explain. he's like oh no they make special screws with that for that project with the with the washers attached and he goes somewhere and he pulls out exactly what we had taken out of our old little roofing awning thing here and it's like oh it wasn't like these people who installed this the first time randomly chose these screws there's a reason why these are made for something that has a curvature to it because the rubber will cling to it then the other day i'm in chipotle of all places and if you can picture the inside of a chipotle those things are often designed with a lot of like exposed kind of like um industrial kind of metal exactly brushed stainless steel and a lot of it along the walls is corrugated something that i don't even know if i really noticed before and what is attached to them but these very specific screw and washer sets and distract them and take some of those screws right i did that's exactly what i did and of course this stuff is wavy so how do you install something that's wavy onto a flat board well obviously they make these wavy um little pieces of wood that go underneath it so that everything will be flush and it's kind of like you just for me somebody who's never engaged in a lot of like

home projects before you just look around you take everything for granted and then or or granite you might take everything for granite as sure as Fred Flintstone joke as Fred Flintstone might say um And then you realize, oh, if we're to do this project again or work in another bathroom again, we'd realize, oh, everything is just kind of standard in some ways. I mean, if you're installing, you know, stuff from another era, that's where things get more difficult or if you're trying to retrofit. But for a lot of these things, you don't have to reinvent the wheel every time the way I would just assume you do.

Well, yeah, to that point, and we should head for the break here, but which is the thing I like to say right before we do another 40 minutes.

Right, we'll get to Paul in just a moment

One of the things that I've been learning From working on this project with my dad It's just Insane the amount of knowledge that my dad Has about little things like that, like if I said Okay, I'm going to put this particular kind of Awning up or this corrugated plastic, whatever You call it, he'd go, okay, we're going to need to get your You know, your rim flams And your, start to get it like Patriot language, some splice Nut, you know, whatever they Say with all that crazy, like, but he would know exactly what the name of that is and he would know that that's what you use and if my buddy Richard who's the contractor that I'm using for some of the bigger stuff came over and they were talking the two of them they would both know exactly the the thing that you're supposed to use for a whole variety of different stuff and it's it's so I mean it sounds crazy that I would think this stuff was haphazard but I think I kind of did like I didn't understand that there is a specific way to do most of this stuff and the people that do it a lot know exactly what that way is exactly why you don't buy a different thing like if it were on me to go to the store and get what i thought was the proper screw for some kind of job i would 100 get the wrong one but everybody like my dad would know exactly what the right one is and if you woke them up from a dead sleep like we once did to camaro kev's brother to ask him the code for mike tyson punch out they would just tell you right away what the things that you need for these various and the consistency like you know what i mean like the fact that like my dad will say it and then i'll be talking to some like the architect or a contractor and then they'll say the exact same thing i'm having this whole issue boy i'm sorry that i just took this baton but i'm having the siding of the tbtl studio is going to be something called hardy panel i've talked about this on the show too much and i like the look of it because it's kind of modern and we've actually got listeners that work for hardy panel i've been emailing with by the way very challenging to get stuff from hardy panel because you can't buy it as a regular person you have to go through a distributor you basically i have to be a contractor who's calling like boise cascade but there's this thing called a drip edge that i need in between these panels so imagine these are four by eight sections of this thing called hardy panel they're going to be installed on the building and there's going to be you know the places where they connect with each other where they bump up against each other and those edge Because it's not a shingle Like if you look at the outside of your house and you see your shingles Or your siding You notice that the top piece of siding Or shingle overlaps With the next one down and then that one overlaps With the one below that and that one overlaps with the one below with that Have you given any thought in your life to why that's the system Because I sure hadn't

Well I don't know if I'm right or wrong That seems intuitive to me Because if water is dripping down You don't want cracks in between them for it to stop

I never thought about the rain shedding the water shedding system and why if you do something like this hardy panel which is a big flat square you then have to that doesn't overlap with the thing below it it doesn't you know hang over you got to do something else you got to do a drip edge well i didn't want to do a drip edge because i had this one picture in my mind of how this was going to look my dad was like yeah you need to do a drip edge on that and i was like do i i was like i don't i i i looked at these other people's house and i don't think they had one he was like yeah well you're going to want to have a drip edge and i like was the closest we got into an actual argument like in the whole time we've been doing the project and then when he was doing something i got on the hardy panel manual which is hundreds of pages and it got down to this particular panel i'm doing and sure enough what does it say you got to have a drip edge of course you do of course you do because like my dad just knows that kind of shit and it's like what what was i thinking i was going to prevail in this argument i was gonna know more about drip edge technology and when it was necessary than my dad who's been doing some version of this for 50 years well so you're gonna do it yes because i don't want

the tbtl studio to fall over yeah right exactly do you know that and well this will be the last thought there's not a lot there's not a lot here but just sort of thinking about sealing things up when we installed the like the the the sink and vanity in our in my basement bathroom here and Keep in mind, like I'm not doing what you're doing here. I'm taking what was a pretty shitty basement bathroom and making it a little bit nicer. Right. And I do like this, this standard, this standard vanity and sink that we got from Home Depot. But the it didn't it, you know, didn't line up with the wall perfectly. There are just imperfections and floors and angles or whatever. And so, you know, on the left edge of the sink, maybe it's I don't even want to I don't even hazard a guess with measurements. But let's just say it's like a centimeter or less or a millimeter. But then as you follow your eye to the right edge of the sink, I'm sorry. So the left is closer to the wall and you follow your eye to the right edge of the sink, like where the back of the sink meets the wall, it's going to be a little bit wider, like maybe a centimeter or two or something like that. Again, I may be exaggerating that depth. But anyway, I knew I needed to seal this up. Now, I had never caulked anything before. Genevieve has used a caulk gun, but usually like with kind of a white caulk that can be exposed. Right. But I I was telling Vives like, wow, this is a pretty this is a pretty wide gap here. And she's like, from what I know of caulking, I'm not trying to tell the story as and I was right. And Genevieve was wrong. It was just very satisfying for me. Genevieve is like, I'm telling you, if you try to fix that with caulk, it's going to be big and ugly. and we need to maybe buy some caulking tape or something i'm like the caulking tape is going to look worse we went back and forth and i just watched like half of a couple of youtube videos i'm just like i think i think i can do this but the key is let's get some like transparent caulk you know the stuff that isn't necessarily white it's more translucent and i saw a couple of quick tips about how like if you have a little bowl with some warm water and like dish soap in there you can kind of clean up your mistakes really quickly get on top of it whatever but i was like i think i can do this like just get me the equipment get me your gun let me let me see if i can make this work oil some water and get me some newspapers tear yeah exactly tear some sheets and i gotta say i i was super nervous because i know it felt like this is the type of thing where if i mess this up every time i'm in the bathroom brushing my teeth or washing my hands i'm going to stare at this and it's going to be oh you mean like when i put in crown molding

in the mount baker house and it was a literally a major disaster and i just used massive amounts

of caulking to try to fix it where what area was this i mean i can't the tv room so you know

not where we would do tbtl when it was upstairs but the the room next to that yeah yeah and i mean the the average person probably wouldn't notice it but i couldn't you every time you walk i couldn't stop staring at it it was it it it traumatized me and this in particular is

something where your eyes kind of would fall if you're in there brushing your teeth every day just listening to morning edition or whatever anyway i've told you i was going to make this quick and i haven't my point is it worked out perfectly i was so nervous with that i'd never used one of those things before obviously i'd seen it before it's not rocket science but it could get messy like really quickly and i i i sealed it up a couple of times i smoothed it out and i it looks exactly how i pictured it not like again if i were building a house from the you know with with good contractors from the Thank you. top down or bottom up or whatever I'm sure somebody would have done it nicer and better but for what we were working with and for me just say I think I can handle this and for it to come out exactly how I pictured it I was very proud I was filled with less shame as we like to say on

this show yeah I wish I had stories that were similar to that I don't from a personal standpoint but I know exactly I can I think understand what you're talking about what I have learned is that my thing is to do enough television stories that I have the money to pay people whether it's my dad or people to do the stuff because I just have no I just am so even that I just don't know if I could trust myself to pull I'm just thinking as you're talking about that I'm thinking of the various projects like that that I have done in my life when I used to live in LA we had an ADU we had a back house we rented out we had this terrible tenant when we first we bought the house a guy was living back there and he was a real piece of work but it was you know the you thankfully he just decided to leave at some point because it's pretty hard to you know move tenants on uh you know in there whatever point is we went in to redo the bathroom when this guy finally moved out and we didn't have any money so i was like tiling how hard can it be and i to this day i weep thinking about whoever has to go like i'm sure that the entire corner of that house fell down because there was zero zero water protection happening like i was trying you know what i mean like i didn't use any drip edges i didn't put in any kind of like green board which is what you really need in a thing like that which is basically a waterproof surface that's behind the tile i remember just being like under this clawfoot tub trying to wedge and i was trying to tile the wall but it's the tiles just kind of it's speaking of things that are wavy it's starting to get wavy because i'm like i've gotten out of sync you know what i mean so it's like i just compounding the errors and just throwing more grout on it and then just kind of being like well i don't know it's a corner hopefully no one ever looks at the corner of this bathroom just oh so bad i'm very envious and admiring of people who know how to do stuff like that or just like learned and i know it's just a matter of time like you don't start out good at that stuff you just do it hundreds of times and you get better at it i just haven't put the time in myself so i'm trying to know my limitations as

well yeah and i you know i don't even know that i see genevieve enjoys doing it like genevieve gets a real rush from it like when we started this project when the weather was a little bit nicer a couple of weeks ago and again Genevieve did most of it I'm trying to think what else we completed we completed a a laundry room project that involved more than just getting the new washer and dryer we took care of like we had this one weekend where or a couple of weekends in a row where we just got a lot of stuff done and then I could see like a switch flipped in Genevieve she was then looking for more projects like for me I'm glad to finally have it done and I'll put it off and put it off and then when it's finally done I'll be like I can't believe it took us so long I can't believe it took us so long to do this because now our living space is so much nicer or now this little awning is so much nicer like I love having it done but when I'm done with a project I'm not thinking what's the next project I can do because it's not like for her that's what drives her she loves project mode and I'm just kind of like good we did a project I am now done for a year wake me up at the end of winter I am

excited to get i the problem for me with project mode right now is the projects are so massive that they're kind of dispiriting i look very forward to getting done to where then a project is a weekend project oh you know we should um i should dig up these this flower bed and put some new kind of landscaping in or something i look very forward to that being the scale of projects that i'm trying to do as opposed to where i'm at currently but um you know i the journey of a thousand miles starts with a single step as i said to my dad the other day how do you eat an elephant one bite at a time i'm just coming up with a lot of bromides none of which is building the house none of which is making the house actually come together but i have a lot of phrases now was he shocked to hear that you're interested in eating elephants he was he was like i thought you don't really eat meat a

lot i was like well i've been dabbling again yeah and if you're gonna eat meat elephant is the place

to start certainly um all right let's take a quick break and then when we come back uh i do want to play this Ed Sheeran tape and get your, I'm guessing you haven't heard this yet, Andrew. So will you be hearing this for the first time?

I read about it, but I didn't hit the samples.

Yeah. Okay, I've got the samples here. We'll do that in a minute here on TBTL.

On your mark. On your mark. Get set. Get set. Now ready. Ready. Go. Everybody rattle, dazzle.

Hey, let's thank some dazzling donors. These are the wonderful, generous, supportive folks who are keeping tbtl going and we are uh quite appreciative of it you're going to hear a lot about just how appreciative we are as the weeks and months progress because of course we've got the next tbtl a-thon coming up uh fourth of july week perfect timing perfect time to get on here and ask

to please support the show a week when everyone is somewhere else that's not their normal place their normal house they're somewhere river rafting or something so anyway we are going to be doing that uh the week of july 4th but in the meantime we want to thank sandy burnett today they're in atlanta ga hi luke and andrew i don't know uh exactly when i began listening but i believe it was the early days of the podcast and luke was hosting it solo boy those were some dark days sandy i can't believe that worked i can't believe sandy stuck around for that you know you talk

about those days i don't know that i listened a lot and so and i don't want to just pile on i know that you have some insecurities about those days but they couldn't have been you couldn't have hosted the show solo that long it must have just been a matter of weeks no i think i think it was

like post-gen pre having um like a you obviously but even kind of like some sort of rotation of folks i think that uh you know i don't even feel that bad i'm to be honest with you i'm proud that i kept the show going like i knew there was something here i knew we had a small but very dedicated group of listeners who would be sad if the show went away i just kind of felt like i got to keep i got to do this five days a week even if it's a half hour you know we used to just do like a half hour episode i was like i just have to put something up keep doing it because something will break and it did you know you joined the show which was great we ended up partnering with apm so I don't think I feel self-conscious About that except I just remember a few shows where I was Very low And those are just I almost feel like Sad for my past self I feel sad For me having to do the show like in a Hotel room in San Diego before I put on a Pillowy pirate shirt and go out to work At a state farm conference that one comes To mind anyway But listen back to Sandy's message It can Be challenging well she said the show has changed Quite a bit over the years but I still absolutely love it and you both it can be challenging to find the time to listen now that my commute is a thing of the past yeah i'm usually two to three months behind but i absolutely refuse to declare bankruptcy i just want to say that i still love the show both of you guys and the tens and i will continue to monetarily support this beautiful show and its community for as long as i am able p.s i don't have anything to plug but would love it if you guys could play my favorite drop it's older so it may not still be lying around if you do have it would you please play the drop that says damn girl you got some good hair i believe that's the pigo drop oh that's right you explained that to

me recently i'm gonna say damn girl you got some cute hair pigo your life and that was a that was

a um a life philosophy i think it was an early like a youtube video i think pigo stands for pink yellow green orange like as in just make your life brighter i don't know if this person was actually advocating for literally dyeing your hair those colors, but Jen was really big on this

pie-go-your-life thing. If you've got cute hair, I'm gonna say, damn, girl, you've got some cute hair.

Of pie-going-your-life. So, why not? So, there you go. Love to everyone. Sandy. Sandy, if you've got cute hair, I'm gonna say, damn, Sandy, you've got some cute hair.

Maestro? On your mark. On your mark. Get set. Get set. Now, ready. Ready. Go. Everybody rattle,

dattle. It's Brian Lane. In Seattle, Washington I wonder if I know Brian Lane From That name, I mean I've seen Brian's name Associated with the show and being a listener And a supporter, but I also feel like There's a possibility Brian and I Crossed paths at some point in Seattle Do you know technically if I would have taken my My mom would have named My last name after the person who Biologically fathered me, my last name would be Lane. Really? Luke Lane Or Adam Lane If that guy would have, if Jim Lane had his druthers, it would have been Adam Lane. So Brian and I may be distant relatives. Who knows? Brian's in Seattle. Says, hello, fellas. I'm so glad I could re-up my TBTL donation as the last three years I found myself refocusing and trying to create a happiness bubble for better health, more art making, more outdoor adventures, and less stress. Last year, my razzle dazzle was used to plug my art page on Instagram. Oh, I remember this. It's at Print Zero Studios. At Print Zero Studios That's my archaic printing and letterpress Studio. Tens started following me Some of them came out to my studio events And even bought prints. Nice. Thank you Tens This year I'd like to also share my love Of exploring the Northwest and taking photos Of the mundane, overlooked, odd Beautiful, urban, and wild That is all around. This person Sounds like you guys could compare notes, Andrew On photography

Yeah, yeah. See, I'm familiar with The Print Zero Studios page But I have not seen this walk underscore with underscore Brian is the Instagram account that he's talking about here. I'm going to check it out right now. That's where Brian says he posts his city walks, nature hikes and photo scavenger hunts to encourage.

everyone to get out exercise slow down and explore more i include some history resources and a different perspective with each post god that sounds like good content i wish we put half of

this much into an episode of tbtl sounds like a lot of work thanks fellas for all the years of joy

that tbtl has given me well brian thank you long lost brother thank you for uh for supporting tbtl We absolutely could not do this without you. Definitely. Hello and welcome to Top Story. All right, let's talk about this case that kicks off in court today, actually. It's not actually Marvin Gaye's estate, if I have it right. It's the estate of the guy who's the credited co-writer of Let's Get It On. the famous Marvin Gaye song. And they're suing Ed Sheeran over his song, Thinking Out Loud, which they say rips off the music of Marvin Gaye's Let's Get It On. Now, of course, the last time the Marvin Gaye estate, and this was, I believe, more directly his actual heirs and his estate, was in the news over this. It was when they were suing Robin Thicke and Pharrell over blurred lines which they won and which as this new york times piece ben cesaro um cesario maybe ben cesario writing in the new york times talks about how that was a pretty you know that had a pretty chilling effect on a lot of folks because i mean i'll go back to that i really felt like that was a stretch to to give uh i think they were five million dollars and they were found you know to to owe the estate of marvin gay for supposedly stealing his music to make blurred lines i just i just i kind of go with the ed sheeran approach which is cited in this article which he says look there just are only so many chords and notes um and can i ask you a question

around this time i remember going really um deep on the blurred lines um issue with you in fact that's one of those where i don't know if we talked about it over the course of several shows i'm sure we offered updates but i remember like what studio i was in in los angeles while you were in probably um poor towns and while we did that and you playing all the tape it's just one of those moments of tbtl that just really stands out to me we kept going back and forth with the music but around that same time there was another lawsuit that involved tom petty and a musician who i want to say is ed sheeran but i know it's not ed sheeran but it's british so you're in the neighborhood it was sam smith sam smith it's weird that i get those guys confused are they

Are they both redheads? No. Sam Smith. I don't think. I think Sam Smith has brown hair maybe. Okay. And he's, of course, his big song lately is the doing something unholy. That's not how they sing it. Oh, I think I have. You've heard that. Mom is at the candy shop and something else. Doing something unholy.

Oh, I know that because is that what he's saying on stage with a bunch of people dressed up like red devils? Yes. And then, like, Tucker Carlson lost his mind or something? Yes. Okay, that's why I know that.

That's Sam Smith. So he has a song, Stay With Me.

Stay With Me was the song, yeah.

And he was sued by the estate of Tom Petty, and I think there's still very much a live Jeff Lynne over their song Won't Back Down off of Full Moon Fever. Nice. Okay, yeah. And, again, that one also just seems sketchy to me because that song, and I should have had that already, but, I mean, that's probably just like a like a c a d or a c d a or a d a c like it's the chord progression for won't back down and stay with me they're just it's a very standard chord progression that many songs employ it's just kind of anyway so uh this uh this is like i said it's not actually marvin gay's family if i read it right it's the um it's a variety of entities related uh to this guy who's credited as the co-writer ed townsend it's the heirs of ed townsend um who uh are saying that uh they think that this song i'm about to play you andrew sounds too much like let's get on so let's start with the ed sheeran song okay this is um thinking what's the name of thinking out loud i gotta be honest with you too this song kind of slaps like i don't have i actually think ed Jared as a person seems really charming Like he's been on Stern and stuff And I just think he seems like an interesting kind of fun guy You know his music is pretty mainstream For me but also The guy is a pretty talented Songwriter and musician I think Anyway this is the song that he put out Thinking Out Loud

Darling I Will be loving you Till we're 70

So you kind of hear that chord progression in the back.

background that's what the marvin gay folks or i should say i'm sorry i don't want to i don't want to blame the wrong people that's what the other guy townsend ed townsend that's what team ed townsend says it sounds too similar to this so one of the things i say in the article is that It's basically the same chord progression Except I think it's the second chord In the Ed Sheeran song is different

Can we hear the Ed Sheeran again? Because I think the Let's Get It On Lives in our brains more Because we've heard it for decades and decades

Okay, so here we go, here's Ed Sheeran again

Darling, I Will be loving you Till we're 70

Let's get it on

Heart could still fall less Heart of 23

Are you hearing it? By the way, I did try to do a mashup. It didn't go well. You mean, oh, you mean before the show.

Oh, I see. I thought you meant just by singing over top of it. What's that? I thought you meant just by singing over top of it. You mean before the show.

Yeah, I think if I was Ed Sheeran's managers, I would just enter this into evidence. This is my attempt to see if I could beat match them or something It does not work at all

You need some AI, man So that doesn't work

Nope That's the audio equivalent of having a stroke it's like the audio quiz of like uh flashing lights or something you know to be like a warning this features sound that will make you feel unsettled trigger your your body involuntarily

something not great will happen um that reminds me i'm looking for it now when's the last time you went back and listened to your remixes of the marsupial gurgle when like when we first a long

time ago i made i made a bunch of different songs right yes and i was listening to them

this weekend because our 10 of the week in the newsletter, Saul said that that was his favorite moment on TBTL, and so I went back to our buddy Lynn's marsupial gurgle website, and I was listening. I'm looking for them now, but I won't derail us, but you did a really nice job with that.

I can't find them in my little system here, which is you'd think they'd all be in my, if anyone would have them, they'd be in my iTunes, or not iTunes, but my Apple

News. Oh yeah, I got them here, I'll play them later, But here's what I was going to say. You asked me what I think about this. And for whatever it's worth, like, I always I hesitate a little bit. I'm going to give you my I'm going to give you my relatively strong opinion on this. But I will say that, like, I people have heard me talk about music. I don't really know what I'm talking about. Like, I don't have any musical background. I know the industry is tough. I know that what's his name? Ed Townsend was a person of color. I think he was a black man who was making music during an era where potentially there were a bunch of people who did not give him and his family the royalties that maybe he was due. Like there might be some there might be some issues of just like being frustrated by a music industry being unfair to people for a long time, maybe specifically musicians of color. You know, those are all things to maybe keep in mind here. But my from my, you know, all that caveat aside, you hear this and you just think that like, I just don't think that Ed Sheeran was listening to that song, even subconsciously and be like, well, I'm going to I'm going to do my own version of that and get away with it. I mean, it's just like, it's such a different, it's not even the same genre, it doesn't seem to me, other than being pop music, right? Like, it doesn't seem like, it just doesn't seem to, and I don't understand how we can go around making music if we can't use certain chord progressions, where they're finite, they are finite, right? Like, so that's where I am, but again, take it with a grain of salt.

I agree with you by the way and it's a good point that there is a history of well let's say everything capitalizing on and extracting value from particularly marginalized folks and it not the folks that were you know singing the songs and writing the songs and making the music and all that often being denied what was really their due and particularly with black artists. so that's a very real thing and not something to sleep on that being said it's like yeah those songs don't sound the same to me and like i don't know i here's also though this is where my my argument i think is starts to sort of lose lose its um effectiveness pretty quickly i also kind of just feel sometimes like i don't know man you're the great grandkid of someone who did something like it'd be one thing if ed townsend was like hey uh you ripped my song off like that to me would i would i would have so much more i would i don't know i if the people who did the thing maybe this i'm just resentful that no one in my lineage wrote anything interesting that i could then sue over as the estate of farnham burbank like i just that there's nobody in my family history that's done anything that we could then i as the great grand kid could be like you stole farnum burbank's legacy well think about it this way though maybe

like in the future somebody will make a joke about paul mccartney losing money on 15 uh hit tickets and adelaide in the future will be able to profit off of that since that was oh she already is she's been telling that joke all over capitol hill dining out on it as it were ridiculous but but

right like i know that that's not how the law works the way the law works is if there is something That is of value including the rights To a song that is As valuable if not more than a home You could live in or anything else and so As one of those things it obviously Is passed on to the heirs But there's something about basically like Profiting off of a thing you had Nothing to do with just because Your uncle happened to like write this Song I've always just and that Totally probably has to do with my own resentment around The fact that that doesn't apply to me in any Part of my life but there's also just like when it's like the estate of so and so is mad it's like the all i cannot help but picture a bunch of people who are younger and had nothing actively to do with the thing that was generating the money but want to make sure that that money doesn't stop coming in when the next

time they use that song in a target ad and it kind of depends like i mean i think some people approach it as in like well we're trying to keep our grandfather's legacy or grandmother's legacy or whatever the thing is and like and so you know what was oh why would i bring it up if i don't even know but it didn't target get sued like 15 years ago for like reanimating fred astaire or something i think i got a lot wrong there but you know like took like took some old footage and reanimated somebody who had long left us and then had him dancing in some sort of a commercial and the estate wasn't it didn't seem like they were like hey we want to get our beaks wet it was more like hey he wouldn't have done this you know that i have nothing but respect for yeah if you're i mean

Because that's – you're costing yourself potential money by saying, hey, we just want to make sure that this person is remembered the way that they would have liked to be remembered or thought of in the way they would like to be thought of. Like that I have a ton of respect for. But I just – the idea – I just always felt a little – a teeny bit resentful of the estate of so-and-so going on what seems also just kind of like a fishing expedition on some of these ones. Like really did you get enough money off of this thing that you didn't do anything to create? Now, again, people email in and say, yeah, what about, like, the third heir to the Johnson & Johnson fortune? Like, they didn't make that stuff any more than Ed Townsend's grandkids made Let's Get It On, right? So, I mean, I understand it's inconsistent what I'm talking about. I'm just talking about how I feel, Andrew.

Do you know, and this is shifting gears, as I sort of threatened to do, and I've got to be cognizant of the time here, too. We want to get to this email about Paula's big secret. Yeah, we do. I have to point this out. I was just doing a little poking around. I am on the Marsupial Gurgle website, and I'm on the Marsupial Gurgle The Remixes page. And I'm realizing, I tracked down based on Lynn's notes here, that these samples come from episode number 1584, 1584 in a collector's series of TBTL. That was almost exactly nine years ago to the date, Luke. It was the ninth anniversary of these remixes were actually Friday. So I'm just a weekend behind on having you relive these remixes that you made of me making a weird sound accidentally while considering a question you asked me about the future of media entertainment. I made a weird sound as I was trying to formulate my thoughts. And then some listeners are like, there's the sound. Some people are like, that's a weird sound. What was that that Andrew made? You remixed it into a bunch of songs and had me rolling. This is from 2014. 2014.

Bad Boys for Life.

There you go. You can really hear the...

How about the one I did? I think I've found them now finally. It's because I call these Andrew Weird Sound in my system, not the marsupial gurgle. but like this is one this was where i got really like um kind of out there this is some brian eno like deep blue day or something i think

Man, I love that Brian Eno song. It's really what I'm picking. The Kanye one is the best. I don't know if you have it on your end.

It'll be less impressed because it'll be from the chorus.

I've got it right here. Yeah, this is the Kanye one. This one, this was actually, I'm kind of proud of this one. This was actually musically deece, I think. Let's see here. Let's see if this is the right one. Because you mixed in a lot of stuff.

I mean, happier big picture. I don't know. I'm happier with my media.

I think, I mean, happier big picture.

Big picture, I don't know. I'm happier with my media options. Media options.

Please welcome the wickedly talented media options.

Oh, shit. Things are hard. There you go. I still cannot. I think this is the version here, and then we'll go to the break. But this is, I think, the original version in context, and I still don't understand how I made that noise. oh i guess that's it anyway i can't find it on the fly here but me just listening to our conversation and you asked me like is it better or worse what you know is tv better now now that we have a million streaming options i mean it's such a 2014 conversation too and and then like i'm just like and i just make this weird noise that i could never recreate for the life of me or even understand where it came yeah yeah yeah well we're gonna do more of that good stuff now

that we're going independent andrew more time in the production dojo and more uh i need you to start making more weird sounds is the big thing so i got something to work with no that one's already used oh she needs to do another one i finally recreated it perfectly here i go once again with

the email every week i hope that it's from a female no man it's not from a female okay i'm

excited but nervous but mostly excited yeah so we set this up at the beginning of the show Paula Poundstone told this story on our show on Friday and said that during this encounter with Alan Rickman, she was sitting at a table in this restaurant with a very famous actress and she would not reveal who it is. I think it's interesting that the book that actually reveals who that actress is. By the way, this is Donald who wrote this in the name of Paula's book from 2006 is there's nothing in this book that I meant to say once again. I'm not sure if we should be sharing this. I know. But here it is. I'll read Donald's email in full. Donald says, I did a little research into the Paula Poundstone, Alan Rickman story. And I now know both the year it took place and the name of the famous actress. Really quickly, Paula didn't say the year. She tried to come up with something that was very wrong. She said 2017. It definitely wasn't that. But we knew that it was after Die Hard, but before Harry Potter. OK, that was one thing that we learned on the show. It turns out Paula described this Alan Rickman affair in her 2006 book. There's nothing in this book that I meant to say. The version of that story matches pretty closely to what she said on TV, except she downplays the whole Billy Joel aspect. That's interesting. I wonder if an editor chopped that. She also adds in the book that she told Rickman and friends that she'd seen the English patient, quote, three years ago since that movie came out in 1996. That means the story probably took place in 1999, two years before the first Harry Potter film. That all scans. That makes so much more sense. And, of course, she names the actress she was having dinner with. One night a few years ago, she wrote, I was dining with... You know, actually, I'm looking at the clock. Do we have time to get into this now? No, we'll do it for tomorrow, though. Okay. One night a few years ago, she wrote, I was dining with Mary Tyler Moore and her husband, Robert Levine.

Hold on, the drum roll's still going. I didn't time this out perfectly.

Mary Tyler Moore. Listening back, you can almost hear Paula thinking, oh, crap, when Luke followed up on the ping pong table story.

This is much later than Mary Tyler Moore came up in the conversation.

If she knew Mary Tyler Moore, you were within a hair's breadth of getting her to crack because she had also mentioned that she wanted to leave her ping pong table to Mary Tyler Moore as a kind of a joke in her will. And then but but Mary Tyler Moore.

passed on first and you said do you know Mary Tyler Moore and then she totally like sort of downplayed it and didn't say anything so she clearly I thought she even said no I thought she said no to you when you asked if she knew Mary Tyler Moore maybe she was just

trying to not at the time so she said I wanted to will my ping pong table to her I said did you know her she said not at the time which indicated she had met her later and now we know she really had because she was there

interesting maybe Paula told you guys about it and you had to edit it out nope that was not the case what you heard was pretty much live to tape but uh i'm just wondering why didn't

mary tyler mary tyler moore run into the middle of that italian restaurant and throw her hat into the air yeah distract alan rickman and everyone else from paula's gaff that's the move yeah oh

wow well thank you what's the listener's name um it was donald who sent that in donald and if we have time for nope i'll save this for tomorrow but i'll tell you what it is because then i'll share my story too which i think i shared but i'll um i'll tell it again on tomorrow's show So we had a dazzling donor message from Jack last week, and Jack kind of as an aside said something like, oh, of course, it was interesting the time I found out my dentist worked in the adult movie industry, but that's a story for another time. And we said, no, that's a story for this time, for right now.

That's the essential story of our time.

And I also mentioned that I had a story about the time my dental hygienist asked me if I wanted to smell her armpits, and that was in the past five years or so. So Jack wrote in with the story behind his dentist and learning that he was in adult films. And I will share. And then Jack ends his email by saying, so, Andrew, what's up with these armpits? So we will share both of those stories on tomorrow's episode of TBTL.

Love it. All right. That is going to do it for today's episode. Got another email about my training session. Oh, at 8 p.m.

yeah let's try to get Beth on the show this week yeah we should talk about that I really

let's see Beth is being I'm now reading the full body of the email Beth is being per always unbelievably gracious about it but I should probably just knock it out but also it's good content if I don't so I'm really honestly Andrew I may have to not do it just so we have more good content

on the show okay well bad boy for life

mhm we ain't going nowhere except July 3rd then we're actually we are going somewhere oh I'm excited at some point we've got to announce where the TB Cellathon is going to be happening this year Andrew because people will be intrigued by it yeah definitely

I'm excited about that we have a lot to do down the line

alright thanks for listening everybody we will be back here tomorrow with more imaginary radio for you in the meantime have a great Monday go Mariners and please remember no mountain too tall

and good luck to all

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