Muse

Listen, every day at around 2.30, my armpits get sweaty. Okay. And I used to hate raising my hand in class to answer a question. But one day I had to say, who cares? I have swampy armpits and I'm going to answer all the questions I want. I'm swampy and I'm proud.

Tina, where are you going with this?

I'm saying just because you think something is embarrassing doesn't mean you have to be embarrassed by it. We all have our swampy pits. My swampy pits is swampy pits.

Have you tried dad's deodorant? It's like military grade.

He gets it on the dark web. TBTL.

I'm a man of few words, but those words will count, and so will my actions. You, like, are definitely, you're the real thing that a lot of people say. So, do you think if you weren't, I mean, if you were less fake, do you think you would be, or you could, or you have a desire to?

If you feel uncomfortable at any time, give me the sign.

I keep losing at deals, and I don't want to make a deal anymore. All you have to do is study it out. Just study it out, and you'll see. You haven't done your homework, buddy. Hey, you know what time it is? It's time to get real.

Well, all right, hello, good morning, and welcome, everyone, to a Thursday edition of TBTL. The show just might be too beautiful to live.

Isn't there a slank at somewhere you should be filling with your farts?

My name is Luke Burbank. I am your host. Here's my sweet stash. Let's freaking party. Coming to you from the Hollywood Broadcast Center Right here in Portland, Oregon Where we are We're looking at a cloudy day, actually This is a little change of pace It's been just bright blue skies Every day for the last I don't know, week or so I think today is going to be a bit overcast But I'm good with that because Tonight, maybe that will cause more people To deign to come indoors For tonight's Live Wire At the Alberta Rose Theater here in Portland

I'm so excited about this show.

We do have a heck of a lineup. We have Demi Adichiebe. We have Jamie Loftus. We have Ken Jennings. We have Hector Tobar. It's going to be a night. I think there's like five tickets left. So if you'd like to come see me sweat right through a white suit looking like some kind of off-brand Tom Wolfe, come on down to the Alberta Rose Theater tonight. Or better, go to LiveWireRadio.org and get tickets so that you don't show up at the theater and find out it's sold out. Okay. That's my pitch for my other job. Let's talk about this job, the one that I'm actually doing right now. This one arrives at episode 3,962 in a collector's series.

Let the fun begin.

We've got a couple of legal stories to discuss with you.

It's literally illegal.

You know, we're considered a couple of the, I think, sharper legal minds in the podcast scene. Neither of us went to law school, Andrew or I, but I think that gives us a certain... We're able to really think outside the legal box because we don't know where to find the legal box. So we stay well outside it, which is what people love when we talk about legal and Supreme Court related things, including a story from the Supreme Court where they have sided with Jack Daniels in a case pitting them against a dog toy company. Can I pet that dog? We'll tell you what's going on with that also. So a lawyer is in trouble for using ChatGPT to find some precedent-setting cases related to representation of his client. I wish I hadn't done that. It's actually pretty funny. We'll talk about that, too. Plus, it's Thursday, a.k.a. Blur's Day. So, of course, we'll do those Blur's Days. And we'll talk to this guy, longest-running Cobra of the show, maybe best known for his depictions of the tall ships, their grace, their splendor, and those intricate riggings. I don't even know if he remembers that TBTL is going independent on July 3rd I don't think he's stressing at all

This shiny guy always worries

He is Andrew Walsh and he's joining me right now Good morning, my friend

Good morning, Luke Boy, did I have a little mini freakout related to this show yesterday What happened? You know, we don't really edit this show much As the listeners will not be surprised to hear But there are

Oh my god, I'm freaking out!

There are occasional things that I need to take out Like every day, like when we stop down for a break, you know, there might be 30 seconds of you and me being like, okay, you ready for the next segment or whatever. And I take that out. And then if something is especially stumbly or bumbly on my part, I might put a little marker there and go back and clean it up later. Nothing big. But just the idea of maybe having an unguarded conversation with you as innocuous as it may be, accidentally ending up in the podcast just absolutely terrifies me. And as you know, Luke, and as I'm guessing the listeners know, I'm very particular in the way I go about my editing and posting of the show. There's a lot of ins. There's a lot of outs.

Are there going to be fewer ins and outs starting July 3rd?

Yes.

We will not be dealing with the 17 different systems one needs to upload a show once we go independent. But this has nothing to do with that. I'm not trying to throw shade at the current system here. This was me taking the file from yesterday's show, dragging it over to my desktop, and renaming it as I'm supposed to do every day, right? Giving it the date and title or whatever. And then I make all of my edits, and then I upload the show, and I do all the things. And the show's now been alive on the internet. Alive, I say, on the internet for five, six hours or something. And then I'm getting ready to go out last night, meeting up with some friends for dinner, and... Going out to, like, the discotheque or something? Yeah, I was going out to the discotheque. I was going to eat a beefsteak at the discotheque. Do you know why I say a beefsteak at the discotheque by any chance?

No, I don't. Because the only... Sorry, I was on the floor petting the cat when... I thought you were going to talk for longer.

The only time I've ever heard discotheque was in my Spanish language textbooks when I was trying to learn Spanish. And that's also the only – I think I just said Spanish, which means that's why I got such a bad grade. Muy mal a Spanish. Muy mal a Spanish. But beefsteak and discotheque were two words that were often in the fake sentences. I guess the real sentences, the practice sentences in my Spanish textbooks. I was like, I don't think seems redundant, right? Yeah, I guess so. But I guess in some cultures, they just call it a beefsteak. I don't know. I can't answer that question. But also, I don't know, going to the discotheque, listening to, oh, who is in Miami Sound Machine? I feel like her name. Gloria Estefan was often conjured in these textbooks, you know, just to keep it relatable.

But sometimes you have to visit the bagno at the discotheque. And you need to know where it is.

Donde? Donde? Is it esta or es? Donde esta?

Oh, God. I'm so sorry to the listeners who are having to tolerate this, the listeners who actually speak Spanish.

Anyway, backing away from that.

Okay, so you went out to the discotheque last night. You had a beefsteak. You couldn't find the bathroom.

Yeah. No, that's it. And then I banyoed all over myself. Oh, no. No. Anyway, so my point is I'm a little bit tight for time. I'm just sitting down at my desk for a second, maybe to put my shoes on or something. I'm supposed to leave in like five, ten minutes. And I'm looking at my audio editing software, and I see I left today's show in there or yesterday's show in there, which is fine. But I notice it has a little asterisk next to its name in like the file organizer window, which means it's not saved, which means I made some changes to this file at some point didn't save them but uploaded the unsaved file to our system meaning I don't know if it's something as small as I edited out like a second of silence that bothered me and then didn't hit save or there's a whole conversation in there of you and I talking about why the January 6th protesters had some good points and i was just like i was freaking out i didn't have time to like go back to what i posted and scrubbed through the entire show looking for an edit that i don't even know what it was i don't know what it would have been you and i didn't have any like big i don't think you and i sometimes our line will drop and so that's a big edit that i have to take out as you and i re-establish our connection or whatever um i don't think we had any of that yesterday but i just like i just could not remember what was in the show what was edited and why i would have uploaded a non-saved version and so i texted a couple of friends who i knew would have uh probably listened to the show all the way through through already and and i didn't leave the house until i got confirmation from them that there was nothing untoward or weird or just awkward in yesterday's show but that is i i went to panic mode man i was like what did i upload to the internet i have no idea

I'm fascinated to hear that we have listeners You have friends who listen to the show Like are hitting refresh so quickly That like between posting the show And when you were going to go out to the discotheque They've already consumed the entire product And can tell you that there's nothing in there That we don't want in the show

Well I can tell you who these people are They're well known to you And the TBTL greater listening audience Luke Now keep in mind the show has been up for Again I probably posted it around 1 and I was leaving the house around 7.30. So I'd been up there for a while, right? Okay. But one was Phyllis P. Fletch Fletcher, who had already been texting you and I about things she'd heard in the show that day. So I had a feeling she'd finished it. And then the other would be John P. Sklaroff. I don't know if his middle initial is P. But he is, of course, our pal at 8pm and he listens not because he likes it because he considers it his job. Professional obligation. Exactly and he feels like he says if I like my job too much then it's not work that's why I listen to your show. Yeah you know who else is listening to the show

somebody who knows the Seattle Mariners the one time Seattle Mariners pitcher Bill Kruger I got a text today from Kerry saying I heard it on the wind that you were picking on my guy, Bill Kruger. What? Picking on? Hold on. Okay. Sorry, I'm panicking. That's what you left in. Your whole diatribe. No. The place that Carrie works, I think there's a 10 that works there who heard us talking about Bill Kruger and also, I guess, Bill Kruger works at this same place. It's like an investment firm. And so I was like, no, no, no. We were I was like we were defending him a listener Said he was the former Mariners TV Guy and we were saying he still has that job And then She says I was just joking One of the tens on the inside Sent a message something about Andrew saying That Bill Kruger has a mountainous face

God damn it dude

And I was like no no no that was a compliment

I was texting you that night about what a Dumb saying I knew exactly what you meant You didn't mean it like I can't believe that came back through like

like through a game of various alimony and palimony related channels that is a cringe

moment from two shows ago that you talked me down from via text and it's being spread around

the internet it's getting it's gonna get back to bill krueger that's the real i don't want the mountain to crush my skull but no no listen listen i knew exactly what you meant what you meant was bill the one-time mariner pitcher bill krueger who very likely threw the pitch that ellis burks fouled off in the kingdom that then I recovered, okay? That's how this conversation started. He has a very strong jawline. He has a good solid head of hair. He's actually a very nice looking man, certainly for his age. And there's something very kind of almost Mitt Romney-esque about him. And when you said mountainous face, you just meant he just has a very solid, very kind of handsome, but also very mountainous face. I knew exactly what you were saying. It was not an insult. A granite like visage. There you

go. Like you could be on Mount Rushmore. Exactly. Or the old man of the mountain, which is my go-to as somebody who lived in New Hampshire for a decade. But before it collapsed. But before it collapsed, certainly.

Unlike the Mariners pitching yesterday.

That is funny, though, that that one thing that I, I mean, listen, I say a lot, and maybe that isn't so funny. Like, i torture myself over a million things i say on this show every day but something that you and i actually were texting about later that night because kruger came up i think you saw him on

the broadcast and i yeah and i was like okay we're not losing our minds yes uh you know anyway still works on the show um well a mountain face i apologize to everybody what would be it let's come up just so this just so we have you know i mean honestly like it's all about preparation right? It's all about just what do they say? Luck is the intersection of preparation and God's will perspiration let's just for somebody like Bill Kruger who has a kind of a very strong kind of face like that what can we use other than mountainous? Well the fact that you said

Mitt Romney

you just say Romney

oh you know who I think of even more than Romney? John Kerry Oh, sure. I mean, I figured he had to be in sport, but he wasn't in sport. Do you have any John Kerry drops?

There's no way you have a John Kerry drop, right? I have one where he says, I can't believe windsurfing cost me a presidential election. Do you remember those days? Do you remember when John Kerry, people were like, can John Kerry win the presidency when we also have photos of him windsurfing, which is seen as a non-relatable sport?

And and Romney, who, of course, I don't agree with on most things, got buried because he said, no, no, we are trying to prioritize, you know, hiring women. We have binders full of women, which was a unfortunate phrase. But like, honestly, you had a conservative up there saying, no, we're making like as governor, I was making a concerted effort to like kind of ask the people in my life to highlight the women who we should be elevating and hiring.

And who actually passed, who basically passed like a health care plan in Massachusetts that was the template essentially for like Obamacare. Okay, so binders of women is what we're going to say next time we have a mountainous-faced person that we want to compliment. Thank you. We got there.

um i'll tell you andrew i lived the absolute urban dream yesterday like i was it was like i was in a like a some sort of what would it be like um an ad that i will see where some young although of course i'm not young but like where some urban kind of person is just having that life and it's like an ad for like a city bank card or something you know what i mean you know the kind of commercial i'm talking about just like where someone's just like walking through brooklyn and they're seeing all their friends who are all drawn from different ethnicities and backgrounds.

And they stop and they get a latte somewhere together and they're laughing.

Exactly. It's like the perfect coffee shop. And everyone's job is that they quilt something for Etsy. It's just like a non-real thing, but it's the dream of what life could be. Well, it didn't go quite that far but yesterday it was really really warm here and I decided well it's a nice day I'm actually going to walk I had to go to the bank do some banking and then I was going to grab some groceries and so I'm walking around it's just again it was warm but just beautiful here in Portland everything's blooming and just got my headphones in I'm listening to All Things Considered and I'm strolling and I go to the bank and they take care of everything super nice I chop it up with the security guard for a little bit, and then I leave, and then I go down to the new seasons. And then I'm, like, buying fruit, which I never do. By the way, I think I might be a fruit guy now.

Oh, nice. I'm a fruit guy. You hear this? Here we go. Oh, that's dried fruit. Bag O'Grapes. Oh, nice, nice. Bag O'Grapes. Hey, don't skip over that. What kind of grapes are we working with today?

Well, they're called grapes. Oh, okay. Literally, I'll send you a picture. No, are they green? Are they purple? They're green. But, like, normally, you know, I had these grapes in – I had some grapes in Texas a couple years ago that were, like, called cotton candy, and they were so good, and I'm always on the lookout for them. These are just called organic table grapes. They are green, and I grabbed them, and I don't know how or why it is that I have not been eating more grapes in the summertime. They're so delicious. I think it's – and I've talked about this before on the show. I think it's because long ago in a waistline far, far away when I used to be real low carb, I didn't eat very much fruit because it does have some carbs in it. I've now fully decided that I should just – if the worst thing that's going to happen to me is I'm going to be getting carbs in my fruit, I think that's an okay problem to have. But it just – I got – my brain got kind of off on it and so it doesn't occur to me. But Becky eats a lot of fruit and always has like chopped up fruit around like in her refrigerator and it's like so delicious on a hot day. So I go and I get – I buy some fruit. I buy like a healthy – some kind of healthy potion drink that's like a soja or something and it's got like, I don't know, some sort of curative properties. And I'm looking in my grocery cart and it's – I have to say it's all like kind of pretty healthy stuff, right? It's like dried mangoes and grapes and strawberries and a couple of artichokes. I've decided I'm definitely planting some artichokes out at the other house because it's on a hill and gets like a massive amount of sun because artichokes are like five bucks a piece. And I have been eating an artichoke a day for the last like three or four days, Andrew.

That's another similarity between you and Genevieve. Like I knew of artichokes growing up, but it wasn't something that we focused on. But Genevieve and her brother was visiting lately and he brought a couple of artichokes, like big artichoke lovers, these folks.

Man, and like make up some garlic butter You boil an artichoke You know, you got yourself a stew So anyway, I'm looking in the grocery cart And it's like the aspirational version of me It's like the guy who's buying artichokes And fresh fruit And drinking some kind of I always feel a little I drank it in the store But I feel a little defensive I feel like preemptively defensive If that makes any sense If somebody confronts you and says Hey, have you paid for that? Right, exactly I'm just opening up this $4 bottle of ginseng juice or something. Not to be confused with gin and juice. That was later. But I'm always like I'm on high alert to tell the person I am going to pay for this. I'm just very thirsty right now, and I need to rebuild my whatever, ginkgo biloba levels. So anyway, the grocery cart is just bursting with, again, all kinds of healthy type things. I did buy some popsicles But it was a hot day I figured it would be And that actually comes up This is This is By the way I was going to say It comes up later in the story But this is not even a story This is just me reciting What happened yesterday So I didn't I had I had a bag Oh that was the other thing Andrew I actually had A reusable grocery bag with me Which I never do Oh really Like I just I'm not good at remembering that stuff, but I actually had a bag with me. So that's another way that I'm being the new version of myself, the new better version. But, of course, I ended up buying so many groceries that it wasn't all going to fit in one bag, so they did have to give me a paper bag. And so I leave the store, and I'm walking, and I'm realizing it's like 90 degrees, and this is kind of heavy. I actually have a fair amount of stuff, and I have a very full bag in each hand, and I'm probably like three-quarters of a mile from my apartment or something. and I'm thinking boy this is going to be steamy and my arm's going to get pretty tired from this like I did not completely think this through and I'm walking and then I I go like a block and I'm just in a random neighborhood here in Portland and what do I see as I come around the corner a freaking spin urban scooter oh I don't I don't really take these things very much but I was like oh my god this is perfect so I whip out my phone I scan the QR code scooter lights up get on the

scooter with my bags and i just what are you doing bag on each no but bag on each side of the handle

bars or bag down by your feet holding the the the reusable bag that i brought i'm holding that in my left hand no no i sling that over my shoulder yeah that's good i have that over my shoulder so i've got of course a hand on each one of the handlebars but then the paper bag which thank god i had the person give me a double paper bag that one i kind of looped over the handlebar that i was also holding and i'll tell you what that did create a certain amount of stress yeah because i was like are these because it was four loops total right i was like will these four loops hold um which they did but i just like i'm just like on this scooter and i'm just like it completely solved the problem i was having which is i'm too far from my house to carry these heavy groceries i got on the scooter i just i was home in like three minutes i didn't go crazy fast i was you know trying to make sure i didn't crash and or destroy my groceries but then i just like pull up to the corner of my apartment building park the scooter turn it off it's like two dollars walk in say hi to the cat get my bag of grapes out start eating turn on chris hayes it was just like a perfect afternoon where I was actually sort of utilizing, and I think I'm using that correctly, I was like utilizing these services and these things in an urban environment exactly the way I think that we were all hoping would happen.

Yeah, those little scooters really make a huge difference, and the little bikes as well. I was wondering, did the bag hanging off of the handle, not just the fact that you were concerned about the handles breaking, did it add to an imbalance?

What was happening, Andrew, and thank you for asking, was there were some sort of like principle of physics at play that I didn't fully understand. If I started going a little bit too fast, the paper bag wanted to rock back and forth like a pendulum, and then it would be out of sync with the scooter. I wasn't off balance in terms of the right side and the left side, but it was kind of sketchy because it was like there was this weighted thing that kept swinging out in front of the scooter and then back. And again, my big fear was these paper handles are going to just like, you know, rip. And then this is going to be like my grapes are going to be spread all over the street and also my fruit that I bought. So anyway, that did happen.

Well, I have some updates for you on my end here. I found an article from 2004, really a good feature length article here from NBC News, but they don't have a byline. So I don't know who wrote this, but it's a feature on John Kerry. and about halfway through we get to his physical description it says here his face too is long and thin suggesting a deceptively sad demeanor comic billy crystal jokes that someone needs to let carrie's face know that he's having a good time his lanky body only serves to accentuate the thick mass of silvery hair atop his head quote in the event of an emergency my hair can be used as a flotation device carrie once joked really making billy crystal's joke seem funnier uh i'm just

yeah that doesn't really unfortunately i don't think that's how hair works yeah and um yeah

just really just amazingly unfunny there um but now so i'm like i don't know if that really gets because i'm trying to go from more of us like these faces are like you know somehow rocky in

some way you know i feel like we owe an additional apology after what you just read yeah well that's

Again, that's John Kerry. I'm just looking, because I don't think anybody's going to, like, I think it's going to be hard to find a journalistic description of Bill Kruger. But I did find this headline from Vanity Fair that I have not read yet. Chief Boston University plastic surgeon on John Kerry's face. Quote, Frankensteinian is not inaccurate.

Whoa.

I believe it's Frankenstein's monster. I'm not getting plastic surgery from someone who doesn't know the difference. I can't tell if this is like, no, I mean, it's van.

Hannity Fair, I can't tell if this is a parody article, if I'm being fooled by the internet or not, but Frankensteinian is not inaccurate, says apparently.

Well, I found something called On the Museum of the Moving Image, which I believe is an ad from 2004, Bush versus Kerry, and it's John Kerry windsurfing. Can we just hear? I don't know. I'm guessing this was made by some pack, but let's just see what they're saying.

I'm George W. Bush, and I approve this message. In which direction would John Kerry lead? Kerry voted for the Iraq War.

By the way, this is footage of him on the windsurfing board. The windsurfing sail is listed, or there's a writing, Iraq War, over the windsurfing sail. And then on one side of the sail is the word supported. And let's see.

Opposed it.

Support. And then the windsurf, you know how when you windsurf, because I know you love to do that. It's one of your favorite ways to surf. You move the sail back and forth. That every time John Kerry moves the sail, it says supported or opposed the Iraq war.

I believe it's. And now opposes it again. He bragged about voting for the 87 billion to support our troops before he voted against it. He voted for education reform.

I cannot overstate to you how bad the production value of this commercial is, Andrew, for just being 18 years ago or maybe 17, no, 19 years ago, right? 2004.

Yeah.

But I think I remember this specific commercial, by the way. I'm not joking. Really, where I'm now fascinated, where I want to take the conversation is just, I mean, was video production this bad at this point? Like, it is like you could have made something better on your phone in five minutes in 2023. But even then, I think you could have. Like, obviously, they think that they're putting a burn on John Kerry that he windsurfs. But they have, like, three seconds of footage of it. So it's like the jump cuts and all these, like, from a production standpoint, it is an absolutely atrocious commercial.

Oh, are you going to continue it, though, or are we done? That was all I was going to say. It's an absolutely atrocious commercial. Oh, okay. Well, then can we move on to the next segment, which is you mentioned that windsurfing is my favorite kind of surfing. That is actually untrue.

Oh, I forgot about web surfing.

Well, I'll tell you what. I don't know if you have any music for this, but I have just prepared a top five list of my favorite kinds of surfing from least favorite to favorite. Are you ready for this? What about OLIs? How many OLIs? I don't have any OLIs. This came back to me a little bit faster than I expected. But here's what I got. I got number five on the list would be kite surfing. Okay. I'm scared of heights. Oh, there we go. Okay. Oh, nice. Perfect. Kite surfing would be number five. I don't like that. But windsurfing would be number two, I'm sorry, number four on the list. Number three would just be surfing surfing. I have nothing against it, but I think I'd be terrible at it. Number four on the list is body surfing, which I can do because I just have a body and I just flop around in there. And number one would be web surfing. You're absolutely right. Web surfing? Yes. I make that as a joke. Yeah, no, that's my favorite kind of surfing.

I remember when I was in Hawaii And I did a tiny bit of body surfing But I told you I realized up close and personal The power of the ocean Because I had always been body surfing And maybe the Pacific Northwest On a really warm day And you're feeling brave Maybe you get out in the ocean shores Or something Even in California A little bit but like hawaii is a whole other situation and so i had kind of been swimming in the waves and had the waves kind of push me a little bit and i'm always thinking oh i almost got some you know i almost surfed that one and then this this wave in hawaii just picked me up and put me down in a way that i was like okay i'm getting out of the water now i don't like this anymore yeah just a

reminder of the of the absolute power of i i've had that i i think i've said this before i'm repeating myself but like as a kid I had no fear of water at all like almost almost to a worrying degree because sometimes I would jump into like the pool before I took my glasses off or whatever and I told you like going down to Florida as a kid we would splash around in the ocean I just loved it I had no fear about it and I have fear about a lot of things but then I didn't go on a vacation like that for decades and then as an adult going on my first vacation again as a young man and going into the ocean and kind of like just diving right in and i was uh i think genevieve's family was out on some errands or something i was by myself and suddenly like just getting just destroyed by a wave and then really feeling the pull under and like i don't know for the first time in my life i was like oh my god the power of the earth is astounding the earth would win in a fight between me and the earth i just remember like just having this like super i can't almost like a realization. I mean, it's such a stupid thing to say, but I just had not contemplated the power of the ocean that way before um did i tell you about the time when i was living in port townsend and i saw a kite surfer very nearly kite surf on top of a pod of orca oh goodness and i was like that person's gonna die and they weren't doing it this person was not trying to be irresponsible or mess with nature uh or you know f around and find out it was just one of those weird things where because you know we were renting this house that was right on the Strait of Juan de Fuca and maybe once or twice we saw a pod of orca go by it might have even been jay pod and I ran out it was so exciting because like these are full-on killer whales and also this was an area where people would kite surf a lot because there's a lot of wind and it just so happened that the pod of orcas is going this way and the guy who's flying literally like 20 feet off the water on his kite and then landing on his surfboard and going up and down is going towards the pod and you know uh orca or killer whales as they might be known are generally not they don't eat humans like they're not violent towards humans like ever ever except some in like i think greece have been ramming boats lately which they're trying to figure out what's going on with that but um i was like i'm about to watch a guy go into a essentially a nature's blender he's going to drop down in the middle of these orca and they're going to go we don't normally do this but we're going to make an exception and just absolutely tear this creature limb from limb yeah i mean

especially i mean they might not be going after humans but any animal is going to react to anything

right they got their babies with them and it's just like you're john carrey you parachute in

you windsurf right into their world of course you're gonna mess with you you come in on a swift boat oh wait hold on exactly you throw your you throw your dog tags over a fence near the beach

Port Townsend okay hey um let's take a break and if we can if you don't mind Andrew I'm gonna run and get one of the world's tiniest allergy pills because okay believe it or not I am like getting real allergic even though I'm inside right now I'm hermetically sealed in this broadcast center and yet um everything is starting to get sniffly and my eyes are starting to burn so um let's take a quick break uh probably play one to six Carvana ads and then I'll be back feeling much better in

a moment here on tbtl hello and welcome to top story uh we got a couple of legal stories now

like you andrew and probably like our listeners i am so so over stories about chat gpt people trying to have chat gpt you know like write the questions for them for the interview or questions of you know at what point will ai surpass us that being said i did see this article that i thought was it was kind of too good to pass simply too good it's the story of this lawyer yes i did grab that on the fly and yes i did edit it andrew without that was me needle dropping this simply too good um a lawyer named steven schwartz uh is uh set to appear before a manhattan judge today to face potential sanctions for his conduct, which is his law firm was representing a guy who was named Robert Mata. He was suing the airline Avianca, claiming he was injured when a metal serving cart struck his knee during a flight from El Salvador to Kennedy Airport back in 2019. The airline Avianca, by the way, I'm reading from Benjamin Weiss or writing in the New York Times, the airline asked the judge to dismiss the lawsuit because of the statute of limitations, and his lawyers, including Stephen Schwartz, responded with a 10-page brief citing more than a half a dozen court decisions with names like Martinez v. Delta Airlines, Zickerman v. Korean Airlines, and Varghese v. China Southern Airlines. Avianca's lawyers were unable to locate any of these cases, And so the judge ordered Stephen Schwartz to give some more sort of support for these various precedent-setting cases that should support his client's whatever, his client's point of view. And he was forced to admit, and I actually sort of believe him, that he didn't really understand how ChatGPT works. He has teenage children. this is um uh mr schwartz said in the declaration that he had learned about chat gpt from his college-aged children and from articles he had read but that he had never used it professionally before he also cited the explosion of news coverage and the ensuing public ridicule endured by him and his law firm these are reasons why he hopes he's not sanctioned by the way it sounds like what happened was and i am taking a very generous uh

Thank you.

kind of read on this situation but for some reason i tend to believe it i can see somebody hearing about there's this new thing chat gpt and it's ai and it's futuristic and you got these college age kids that are maybe using it to write their papers or whatever and so he's like chat gpt find me some cases where somebody sued an airline after the statute of limitations and it actually supports that you should be able to do that and then chat gpt goes off and just invents a bunch of cases um i could see a world in which this believe it or not was not intentional do you i hear suspicion in your voice i haven't commented yet no but earlier like eight minutes ago before my um before i was talking endlessly i thought i heard you being kind of like maybe not so um not so believing that he could have done this accidentally no i wasn't um i wasn't really

familiar with this until you just laid it out just now and i'm now looking at the article Well, listen, my take on this is, yeah, it probably was a legitimate mistake, but that's still, like, just terrible. Lawyering. I was going to say lawyering, but honestly, just terrible professionalism, no matter what your job is. Like, if you, I mean, ChatGPT is a tool that can maybe help you get started on something. But, like, you, so, okay, you're like, well, I haven't heard of this thing before. My kids told me about it. I read a couple of BuzzFeed articles about it. Rest in peace. i did a couple listicles right and then it was like so i figured i would just do it and then so this thing spit this this document out and i just went to court with it and i just filed it without doing any like oh well what like just like reading like then reading what it spit out and then doing your own cross-checking of it and then learning more and learning about those cases like that's

that's that's terrible that is actually very very very shoddy like i mean that's lionel hutt's level

of bad lawyering you're right even if you had a human assistant provide you with that stuff you'd think that that you would have some somebody else go through to just double check i mean we fact check articles in the atlantic monthly like you'd think that like yeah i don't know why i said that genevieve used to work at the atlantic and i just think about the intense fact checking that goes on there i think she worked maybe in that department um but i'm just like you you just walk into court with something that a i spit out and to your admission you don't really understand how it works but you didn't think well maybe i should just i don't know google these cases that's a

really good point so if it was even if it was a even if he wasn't trying to intentionally deceive the court he has proven himself to be an incredibly bad lawyer for doing this and probably should be sanctioned either way can you imagine yeah you're right um can you imagine like you're the client too and like you find out this is how this is how kind of inept your lawyer is that he's just Admitting all this stuff into evidence But hasn't double checked it even slightly

I mean also the fact that all he carries Around in his briefcase is a Apple core I tell you I once had a Dream that somebody I know now that I remember who it is I don't even want to bring it up on The show but I had a dream that one Of the characters on the Dan Lebitard show Was carrying a briefcase I have no idea why this doesn't fit into Really anything about that show except for this this is billy gill guillermo who's a bit of a a bit of a um a little bit of a chaos agent on that show but for some reason he was in my dream and he opened up a briefcase and there was a lit candle inside of it and like i think about that a lot like i almost made a joke here like the when the when the lawyer opened up his briefcase he had a lit candle inside i'm like that doesn't really make sense it only makes sense because i had a dream like that six months ago that i found to be kind of hilarious the idea of carrying around a lit candle in a briefcase in other legal news the

supreme court has sided with jack daniels in a trademark dispute involving a poop themed dog

toy now you can hear incredulousness in my voice over this story by the way really interesting

okay i think so if i understand it correctly which i might not this is devin cole writing uh in cnn uh today the supreme court sided with jack daniels in a dispute over a poop themed dog toy that parodies its iconic liquor bottle, ruling that a lower court erred when it said the toy was covered by the First Amendment's free speech protections. The unanimous ruling written by Justice Elena Kagan allows the liquor maker to revive its trademark lawsuit against a company called VIP Products, though the court's decision is a win for Jack Daniels, which argued that an appeals court made a mistake when it said the toy was, quote, non-commercial and therefore enjoyed constitutional protection the justices declined to grant the distiller's request to completely throw out the test and appeals court used when it ruled in favor of the toy so to simplify that it sounds like the supreme court is kicking it back down to the lower court uh in a way that helps jack daniel's trademark case but not to the completion that they would have hoped for now andrew it's not going to set like a broad precedent basically right and it's and it's it's the day.

They're not throwing out everything the appeals court did. Now, the product in question, Andrew, is a chew toy shaped like a bottle of Jack Daniels called Bad Spaniels. And we're like, I don't know what the real Jack Daniels, you know, has that kind of like, what is it? It has like underneath, like where it says, this is looks exactly like Jack Daniels, but where there's some kind of number of Jack Daniels, like what batch it is or whatever.

Old number seven, I think is what I'm looking at.

Thank you. This one says old number two. And then it says on your Tennessee carpet, which doesn't, I mean, it's like John Kerry level of humor. You can use this as a flotation device. This actually, if you had enough of these, these would make a better flotation device than John Kerry's hair.

Yeah, actually, you're right.

And then if you go way down in the lower corner, the Bad Spaniels, the bottle of Bad Spaniels, it says it's 43% poo by volume. And then on the other side It says it's 100% smelly I don't really understand Conceptually what's What is going on What's the So this is something your dog chews on That looks like a bottle of Jack Daniels But it's actually called Bad Spaniels But is the joke Is the bottle full of Spaniel shit No there's nothing

That is just the You know that's a parody of the proof And then the percent right don't fifth of whiskey usually have like a percent and a proof right and so they're just like you

know the jokes aren't great yeah but i just okay because that's the part that that's i just want the joke to be a little bit more consistent yeah no no okay the jokes are bad listen but like these

things like um our friend katie i'm pretty sure that she was um passing around photos of her dog like chewing on i i want to say it like um not fresco la croix la croix toys or whatever like You see this a lot. Sorry about my stumbling there. But also, sorry about these sirens. I was trying to... I know they're very loud today.

Which is you actually live... I mean, your street is relatively quiet, but you guys don't live very far from a fire station. The other day, I was talking about how relieved I was that when I'm here in Portland, I'm pretty close to emergency services. But you guys are like a few blocks away.

Yeah. And usually it is not an issue because they're not usually running their sirens until they get to the main throughways. But yet today, for some reason, they have their sirens blaring. But anyway, point is, yes. So I so like, you know, I know that my friend's dog, Poppy, has like, you know, little toys and they're funny because they or maybe some that looks like a crock. I don't know if that's a thing or not. But, you know, so these are standard dog toys, but the court basically is kind of ruling or at least considering the idea that Jack Daniels has a case here because, like, you know, this is copyright infringement or whatever the legal term would be in this particular case. But, like, I'm a little bit astounded by that because I thought the whole point is, like, parody is okay unless it's going to, like, potentially confuse the consumer or confuse the marketplace in a way that can hurt your sales. And, like, nobody is buying these dog toys being like, well, I was going to buy a bottle of Jack Daniels, but instead I'm going to buy this dog toy that is a parody of Jack Daniels. If anything, if you're a brand like Jack Daniels or Dak Janiels, I feel like you'd be like, that's good. I'm such an icon now. My brand is such an icon. That's the Silly Squeakers Company, which is the name that's decided to parody me.

I have some other Silly Squeakers I'd like to run by you.

Doesn't it just sort of seem to you, though, that having a bunch of toys and dog toys and knickknacks that look like Jack Daniels is just reinforcing the idea of Jack Daniels' dominance in the marketplace and also maybe even making you think, hey, I could use a little shot of happiness right now.

But what, Andrew, would happen if you were about to have some Jack Daniels and then you picked up a bottle of this and saw that it was 43% poo by volume and 100% smelly? I mean I think the unfun answer is Jack Daniels has a team of lawyers and their whole thing is enforcing their trademark and making sure that – because the argument they would make is, OK, today it's a bad spaniel's chew toy. Tomorrow could be something that is even more sort of destructive to our brand and to our trademark. And if we don't enforce our trade, I mean, the trademarks are only as sort of valuable as far as how much you enforce them. And so they're probably just like we have to be constantly whack-a-moling down people who are making knockoff T-shirts and knockoff whatever because we need to be in total control of anything that says Jack Daniels or even looks like Jack Daniels. Now we haven't heard from the Mountain Dew company Because one of the other things that Silly Squeaker sells Is something called Mountain Drool Which is

It's a squeaker toy that looks kind of like a bottle of Mountain Dew, but instead it's called Mountain Drool. It turns out, Andrew, there's a real brisk industry on Amazon of fake alcohol products that are for your dog to chew on. Like, this is a large section of Amazon.com. You've got Pup's Blue Ribbon. Yes. Yes. And you've got – which looks like you might be unsurprised to find out. It looks like a Pabst Blue Ribbon. Let's see. I'm trying to read.

Are these all silly squeakers or are you just going through Amazon?

No, I'm kind of jumping around a little bit. What I really want to do is read to you. It's really hard to read, but the Pup's Blue Ribbon Shoe Toy has all this writing on the bottom, which I'm guessing is similar to what the Pabst Blue Ribbon can has. I'm trying to read it here, but it's like this photo on Amazon is not that helpful. This is the original Pup's Blue Ribbon Chew Toy, blah, blah, blah. Anyway, they've also got Pup Light, which is a fake Bud Light can, which, of course, I know we've all been throwing out lately because of the Dylan Mulvaney stuff. You've got Barker's Mark Whiskey, which is a chew toy that is shaped like a bottle of Maker's Mark. But it's got a dog peeing on the label, and it says it's 90 Woof. i guess instead of 90 proof that's good it's pretty good uh let's see some of the other uh let me keep scrolling here uh let's see uh fake rose wow some of these get i'm on i'm on the the

um silly squeaker website now my dog toy.com slash silly squeaker some of these are really like this is like bart scompson territory like i would sue just over how bad the joke is because One of them is Silly Squeaker's Smell-a-Ar-Croch. Do you know what that's supposed to be? Stella Artois? Yes. Good job, you. This is a fun game. What about a bottle of Pissness? Do you know what that is? No. That's supposed to be Guinness.

Oh, wow. Okay. By the way, you have absolutely... You've hit the mother load. I was on Amazon, but you're right. This is where it's at. The Silly Squeaker's Do You Know... They have a bottle of something called Blamison, which looks like Jameson, but it's Blamison the dog. How about the guy on the cover is farting, but he's Blamisoning the dog.

This is the younger generation's Garbage Pail kids. How about Heine Sniffin?

Heine Sniffin. Sorry, that's just me taking a picture of the Blamison the dog. Wow. No, I mean, I'm not even kidding, like, let's see, how about, stop rotating, I'm trying to read this one, how about to sit and stay, export strength, what if I, what if I offered you a bottle of to sit and stay, this one really doesn't, I'm really having a, to sit and stay, that's not on you, by the way, that's on how bad, how tortured this joke is, you said a bottle, so is this a beer, to sit and stay, no, no, it's a liquor, it's in a green bottle to sit and stay i'm not there i don't know what tanqueray to sit and stay i'm listen i mean

that that should be a top like that's usually what i drink if i'm ordering a drink like that um bark party instead of bacardi is one of them how about doggy walker okay readable

um and that's just somebody getting pulled along i don't know what the breedable joke is exactly but that's obviously a bottle of Johnny Walker. Let's see. How about if I offered you a chewable can of Panta? I'd take it. That would be their take on Fanta, I believe. How about, staying in the soda space, Mr. Slobber, established 2020. Mr. Slobber.

Is that like Dr. Pepper?

That is exactly. You're really good at this game. That's exactly what it is. Now, I want to try to read the back. Come on. Okay. I'm trying to read. See, the problem is when I enlarge it, it's like the font degrades too much. I'm trying to read with the nutrition facts on the can of Dr. Squeaker, of whatever Dr. something is. I'm really curious how far they went with the, like, you know what I mean? Like writing up the sort of backstory on the product. And we keep going.

Can I offer you a bottle of Blue Cat's Trippin'?

What? Peps Blue Ribbon. blue cats tripping uh how about a uh can i offer you a bottle andrew of kennel relaxin kennel kennel relax uh kennel relaxin is that a beer again or is that a it's a wine kennel relaxin

It's a Chardonnay. Sweepay wine. I don't know. What is it? I don't think I know. No one wants to have one with you. I don't think I know. I don't think I know those grocery store wine brands that well. I'm assuming that it's one of those main. I'm worried about how little you know about grocery store wine. What is it? It is supposed to be Kendall Jackson. Oh, okay. I can picture that. I can picture that font. Yes, Kendall Jackson. Okay. But I would have never gotten there. Yeah. And then let's see. I just maybe one more here. Uh, no, that's not even, oh, oh, you know what it is. If I offered you, if I said, let's celebrate, let's open a bottle of meow. Meow. Just let's sell. So is that some sort of champagne? Uh-huh. Bubbles, let's open a bottle of meow. What do you think? Let's open a bottle. Cristal? I think it's a moette. Oh, a moette. Oh, moette. So it doesn't, it doesn't translate to say it out loud, but the, the. No, yeah, the, the, the, the font. right right it's pretty uh right it's pretty good and then last but not least what if andrew we you know maybe it's uh a warm summer afternoon we've just got done playing pickleball on that court at your house oh yeah so you know what would really go really nice right now would be a tweedos and soda a tweedo tweedo tweedo so is it like a bird thing it's okay so tweedos which is obviously Tito's It's like a cat Has a knife and fork And then has a bird That's like in a cage It's trapped it Ooh dark So yeah It's kind of Because they need to keep it They're trying Like they wouldn't make this For birds So Tito's doesn't really Make sense Unless you make the leap That the bird will be Sacrificed To the cat So then you're back In the like And maybe even But also the cats Don't really like Chew toys like this So I guess you're Sacrificing the cat To the dog right Because like you have this For your dog Your dog wants it because it's Tweedos It has a cat on it Your dog wants to eat the cat But then the cat It's a real matryshka Yeah Kind of pet annihilation It's a real punching down Thank you God I can't Did you already say this one? I don't know Sorry I keep saying last one And then Andrew What if I invited you over And I said You know It's a hot day Why don't we Why don't we unwind With a couple of cold Heine Sniffins. Oh, yeah. No, I said that one. Oh, did you do that one? I said that one, yep. It's all blurring together. The logo on the Heine Sniffin is pretty solid as well.

There's a right way to rock and a wrong way to roll. You can just listen to your soul. Just remember that life is number one. You can be having so much fun. All right, let's do some Blurs days.

I don't know what it is about the month of June, Luke, but this is the second Blurs day in a row. Are we in our second June Blurs day or is this? Yeah, last week was June 1st. Today is June 8th. very light on blurs days. And that's fine. I'm not blurs shaming here. I'm just trying to figure out what the cycles of people's lovemaking is. Exactly. It's, hey, Siri, what was nine months ago? Right. But anyway, we do have some sweet, sweet blurses to get in here. Thursday, September 8th. I meant that jokingly, and then my phone just told me that. Oh, really? Well, I've also got a couple of cases I'd like to tell you about, some precedent-setting cases that I recently learned about on my phone. No, that was technology really doing its job, I guess. Wait a second. There was something I was supposed to mention in the last segment that I didn't mention.

What was that?

Do you remember when we were having thank you gifts made for a previous TBTL-a-thon several years ago now, and we had a design of a parody of a LaCroix can that said something about 10 or something, or TBTL, but it was like a LaCroix. It was a pin. I think it was a pin. It was one of those enamel pins. It was just one of a set of four or five. And the APM lawyers, like, said, nope, you can't do that. I mean, that's exactly this thing, right? Like, we were like, what are you talking about? Like, nobody's going to – this isn't going to affect the market value of LaCroix. Like, why? And they're just like, nope, it's not going to pass muster. And, I mean, I guess this is that. Well, joke's on you, APM legal team, because we don't have one anymore. Yeah. We're going to get sued all the time now that we're on our own. Okay, let's do some blurs. The point is, nobody was bumping uglies in September. Oof. Can I offer you a can of, a bottle of Heine sniffing as an apology? Yeah, wow. Sharon in Chilliwack, British. columbia heck yeah says happy third blurs day to my two and a half aka my granddaughter brianna grandma and grandpa love spending time with you and looking after you while mommy and daddy work you make oh you will make a great big sister next month oh a little sneaky breaking news there congratulations to everybody involved and certainly happy blurs day somebody was on Third Blur's Day, Luke. Third Blur's Day. Let's keep it clean. Looky here. Lance wants to say happy Blur's Day to his amazing, awesome wife, Cheryl Incorvallis. Our longtime friend of the show. Corinne also wants to wish Cheryl a happy Blur's Day. Corinne says, wishing a super terrific Blur's Day to TBTL legend and all-around delightful person, Cheryl in Corvallis Boop Boop I feel so Keep your finger on that

That sounds like a boop to you It's an impossible Listen I don't Listen I don't want to I don't want to Michael Winslow shame you Because I couldn't make this sound How would I make it I like literally can't form the vocal pattern To try to make that So I thank you for trying And I don't want you to feel like I'm giving you grief

Yeah I told you I don't do impressions I told you my girlfriend left me because she says that shocked me. I'm going to try a joke that I failed at like four months ago. My girlfriend left me because she says I do a terrible Arnold Schwarzenegger impression, but that's OK. She'll return that much better. But you gave me the petty laugh this time. The petty laugh. I feel so privileged to. OK, what are we doing? I don't know. I don't know what I'm doing or what you're doing.

I'm just sitting here with a bunch of tiles that make sounds, and I don't have any responsibility to read any of the Blur's Day messages. So it's just, you know.

I know you're nuts, sir. Okay, this is off the rails. This is not a time to goof around, Luke. This is serious, serious business. Let's do a serious Blur's Day shout out from Corinne to Cheryl and Corvallis. I feel so privileged to have met you IRL earlier this year, And I'll always treasure my memories of knocking around Portland with you, touring the Japanese garden, and sharing a meal at my father's place. Oh. Boop. Friendo, you are such a peach. And finally, Matt says, I want to wish a happy Blursday to my 10.5, my longest co-bro of my life, my domestic partner, Jenny. Happy birthday tomorrow and happy anniversary today. Thank you for being my person. I've never loved anyone more If I won the lottery, I'd keep you Wow I don't know how that works When you win the lottery, do you have to give up the money or give up your partner?

Yeah, they don't They don't publicize that part of it But if you look on the back of that oversized check It's part of the tax system Yeah, the fine print is like It's me or them Yeah, exactly Would you keep the money or your partner? Just, by the way Depends on, I mean, God Depends on which partner I'm at in my life

which marriage the amount of money you didn't even say the amount of money that's huge pretty big right that's a really big one all right well that's what i got for you okay all right when i read that arnold schwarzenegger joke on reddit it was so funny and i just can't seem to

translate it to come out of my own mouth the right way i gotta look that up meanwhile i will not stop telling that talking dog joke like which i told you on the show but the guy with the talking dog and uh you know he says i should have said dimaggio or whatever i have just anytime there's a lull in any conversation i'll just i was doing a recording session yesterday for a major software concern and they were tweaking the script and we had this downtime and it's like i'm on this call with a variety of people and i'm like okay so guy walks into a bar with a dog he says i got a talking dog like i if there's ever one minute of of kind of unfilled time anywhere i am telling

that joke now there's something very nerve-wracking about like telling a joke you and i can sit here for an hour as we did today and just go back and forth and i said some things that were maybe funny maybe interesting and some things that definitely weren't but that's fine like it's just a it's just words passing in a stream but then when it's like hey luke i have a joke for you then like it's just

like it slips into like it just feels like there's so much pressure right and also like yeah you want You've got to remember each part of it. You've got to not mess it up. Yeah, it gets stressful. Yet I keep trying. I need to stop doing that. No, no, no, no. The answer is not to stop trying. The answer is to get better at it.

That is true, I guess. You know, I got a voicemail from listener Bill Kruger. His name was William... M.K.

Yes, he does.

Mountainous voice. Now, listen, I'm sorry I don't have your name in front of me right now. It was a very interesting voicemail. I want to almost say Andrew, but I don't think it's Andrew, but somebody who is in the improv scene, clearly. Okay. We were talking about improv the other day. I should just play the voicemail, but I don't have it in front of me right now. But we were talking about improv the other day and how, like, it's really, you know, it's embarrassing, basically. Like, you and I are not necessarily good at it. You were talking about your own insecurities around it, And it's because it's embarrassing. And this listener was saying, I mean, that's the whole thing. Like, the way you train in those, you know, if you want to be serious about improv is, like, if you do a scene and you feel embarrassed, then you have to, like, double what you were just doing. So you feel even more embarrassment. And if you still feel embarrassed, like, triple down. Like, just keep on, like, just make it bigger and more ridiculous and foolish until you basically lose whatever you're clinging, whatever, like, basically it's, like, pride, right? You basically destroy your ego. Kind of, yeah. In a good way. Yeah. Obliterate it. And weirdly, there's echoes of that in Barry. One thing I like about the show Barry, which I'm pretty far into now, but I'm still not done with it. So no spoilers. Of course, you, I think, only watched a few episodes or maybe one season.

Although I have considered getting back into it.

I think you should. First of all, you don't have to worry about verisimilitude because it's ridiculous in so many ways. Like for me, I think the first few episodes, first half of the first season, I think it took me a long time to kind of understand the tone of the show and understand that it's it fancies itself more of a comedy than a than an intense drama, although it really gets really intense. But it is interesting to hear them kind of talk about these various acting exercises, but then to see the show. And I don't want to give away too much here. I don't actually it doesn't give away anything, but to see in some very high tense scenes in season three, how people in real life are maybe subconsciously employing these acting exercises and not unlike the kind that the listener is talking about. like just go bigger just go bigger or there's something there's some sort of principle where you repeat a line over and over and over until it almost loses its meaning it's like an acting exercise and that is something that you hear explained early on in the series and then later on in the series people are sort of doing that in real life it's like a nod to that it's a very it's a very complex show with a kind of a lot going on a little like easter eggs like they're like oh they're doing the thing there right it's pretty it's really well thought out it is a really It is a really well-constructed show, I think.

You know, I am definitely meaning to get back into that show and watch. Because it's like, what, three seasons total? Four.

And so it ended recently. So, like, I'm at the beginning of season four. It's funny. I listened to this recap podcast. I think it's just some podcast thing called Post Show Recaps, where I think they have a whole bunch of people who recap a whole bunch of different shows. and I've been listening to the Barry ones and it's so funny because I will watch a half hour episode of Barry and then listen to a 90 minute recap of it

maybe that should be our next are we going to do any more like podcasts about TV shows I would love

to yeah you know we have some things cooking some ideas of things we might be trying but not that right now but maybe that's going to be maybe a long term goal like I still haven't watched that other LTD show Something Something Limited Oh Perpetual Grace Unlimited Unlimited yes

Yeah that you know what I got like four Episodes in and I thought it was so good and then I Just stopped for no reason that's another Stephen Conrad Show yeah our guy who did Patriot so yeah maybe Maybe we can do something on that anyway okay We are gonna wrap things up Here on this Thursday but we Are gonna be right back here like before you know like blink and we're gonna be back here tomorrow doing another episode of this thing so please do join us for that in the meantime have a great thursday take care of yourselves again um wear your mask and be safe if you're in the part of the world where that smoke is just really really wreaking havoc and we'll see you tomorrow in the meantime please remember to mountain too tall and Good luck to all.

All right, they're going to run. See you on the flippy flops. Power out.