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This podcast is supported in part by Bill, the intelligent finance platform that helps businesses and accounting firms scale with proven results. We often talk about the habits and systems that help people do their best work. For many leaders, that might include building processes that reduce friction and create clarity. That is exactly why so many finance leaders turn to Bill. With AI-powered automation, Bill isn't just moving money. They're simplifying financial operations for nearly half a million customers. They're even trusted by over 90 of the top 100 U.S. accounting firms to get it right. That trust is built on scale. Bill has securely processed over a trillion dollars in real transactions, supporting teams in handling payables, receivables, and expenses. When financial tasks are organized and visible, it can free up time and energy to focus on what matters most, whether that's your team, your mission, or your community. Visit bill.com slash proven and get a $250 gift card as a thank you after speaking with a bill expert. That's bill.com slash proven. Terms and conditions apply. See offer page for details. This episode is brought to you by Walmart Business. The best leaders might tell you the work that moves an organization forward doesn't happen in spreadsheets or supply chain emails. It happens when you have the space to think big. That's the idea behind Walmart Business. It's built to take the friction out of running an organization so your team isn't losing hours to procurement logistics, when they could just be focused on the problems that actually matter. With an ever-expanding business assortment, everyday low prices, and fast, reliable shipping, Walmart Business keeps your operations running smoothly. Shop online, in-store, or through the Walmart Business app. However works best for you. Simpler operations, smarter spending. It's Walmart built for your business. Sign up for a free Walmart business account at business.walmart.com.

This episode is brought to you by AppleCard. AppleCard users get 2% daily cash back on purchases made in-store and online, whether it's for big-ticket items or everyday purchases, when they use their AppleCard with ApplePay. Now that's a benefit that's just too good to pass up. You could be earning 2% daily cash back when you use your AppleCard with ApplePay to buy turmeric for your signature curry, 2% back on flights to visit the family in Tucson, and even 2% back on your kid's new tuba. You might even be able to get 2% back on a tuba tutor. Not an Apple Card customer? You can apply in the Wallet app on iPhone. Subject to credit approval, Apple Card issued by Goldman Sachs Bank USA, Salt Lake City branch. Terms and more at apple.co slash benefits. We talk a lot about the financial health of organizations, but what about our own bank accounts? I'm talking about true, basic personal finance. I know where I go for financial literacy, my special group chat. I'm lucky. A lot of my friends are really entrepreneurial. They are a wealth of information. How to start an LLC, what financial vehicles we should use for retirement? What the heck an HSA is and if we should all have one? My friends know the answers, but most people don't have a special group chat of business-savvy friends to help them out. Personal finance isn't even taught in schools, and most people don't even know where to start when it comes to this stuff. Believe me, I've been there. On top of that, a lot of us aren't comfortable talking about money. Money touches almost every corner of our lives, and it takes time, and trust to get vulnerable about it with other people. It took a while for my group chat to open up about such a sensitive topic too. But the thing is, that fear can be costly. Most of us don't have the luxury to avoid talking about things like savings, budgets, and retirement accounts. This is valuable knowledge that will shape our financial future and that shapes the rest of our lives. So how can we all unlock it for ourselves? I'm the Dupac Anola. This is TED Business, a podcast from TED. Our speaker today is Vivian Tu, and she's here to give us the financial advice she wished she had when she was a broke 22-year-old. She's encouraging all of us to develop community around financial planning, the equivalent of a text thread of your own, so that you're not alone in figuring this stuff out. Then, after Vivian's talk, we'll hear a conversation between her and TED Talks Daily host, Elise Hugh. But first, a quick break. This episode is brought to you by LinkedIn.

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momentum. A good hire, they can help grow your business. But finding great talent isn't easy, especially when you don't have the time or resources to sift through piles of resumes to find the right fit. That's why LinkedIn built HiringPro, your new hiring partner that screens candidates for you. So instead of sorting through applications, you can spend your time talking to candidates who are actually a good fit. With HiringPro, you can hire with confidence knowing you're getting the best talent for your business. In fact, according to LinkedIn, those hiring with LinkedIn are 24% less likely to need to reopen a role within 12 months compared to the leading competitor. Join the 2.7 million small businesses using LinkedIn to hire. Get started by posting your job for free at linkedin.com slash tedbiz, spelled B-I-Z. Terms and conditions apply. This episode is brought to you by PAKA. We all have that one piece we keep coming back to. The thing you throw on before a flight, a morning walk, or just a slow evening at home. The layer that just makes sense. For me lately, that's been my PAKA hoodie. And it's genuinely changed what I think a hoodie can be. I use it all the time, and I think you should try it too. Paka creates outdoor and lifestyle apparel from alpaca fiber, one of the most sustainable natural fibers on the planet. Their signature hoodie is unbelievably soft, warmer than wool, and still breathable enough to wear through all kinds of days. And the hoodie is just the beginning. I've also been reaching for their Essential Rainbow Mountain Crew Socks and the original crew sweater in blue. Both made with the same care and the same unmistakable softness. Once you feel the quality, you'll understand why people keep coming back. To grab your Paka hoodie, go to www.pakaapparel.com. That's www.pakaapparel.com.

and now vivian too takes the ted stage picture this you're 22 you just moved to new york city and you're out at a bar with friends a couple of tequila shots a lukewarm beer later you go to the bartender to close out your tab but then she says the three scariest words known to man your card declined. It feels like everyone in the bar overhears. On one particular night out in 2016, I had to wait until 12.01 for the direct deposit from my paycheck to actually hit my bank account to be able to pay my bar tab. At the time, I was living paycheck to paycheck. And if I'm being honest, the embarrassment I felt that night would stay with me for years. Even though I had a fancy job on Wall Street, my personal finances were a mess. During the day, I would enact trades on behalf of hedge funds worth billions of dollars, and at night, I would go home and wonder if one more pad-tie order would set me over the financial edge. Sadly, this is not a unique experience. Many young people still feel hopelessly lost when it comes to our money. And this is in part due to the existing financial system. Personal finance education is not taught K-12. The past five decades of policy implementation has led to a deep divide between the haves and the have-nots. And if we're being honest, The financial services industry as it currently exists is really only set up and incentivized to help, well, be already wealthy. But here's where the story starts to get really good. There has never been a better time to get financially literate than right now. Knowledge that was once locked behind expensive advisors is available at your fingertips. Ten years after bar night, I have become the financial educator I so desperately wish I had had back then. I built my career teaching financial literacy like a friend across social media. And as it turns out, that boiled down language and those silly jokes and those funny memes, they didn't make me any less credible. But they sure did make me.

more understandable. What started as just videos on social media has turned into a podcast, not one but two books, and if all goes according to plan, a full-blown tech startup. The financial world has finally opened its doors wide. But here are the three things I wish I had known to do all those years ago when I was so desperately broke and wanted so desperately to be very, very rich. One, learn the language, the financial language. Two, build community around money. And three, find modern solutions for modern problems. So let's dive into that first point. It's safe to say learning finance really is like learning a new language. 401k, IRA, 529, FICO, APY, AGI. Hello, can someone please help me? But my ask of you is really simple. Don't be afraid to be smart by looking dumb. Ask what the words mean. Don't be afraid to utilize resources like Investopedia or NerdWallet. And most importantly, find a financial mentor that speaks your language. someone who has the industry chops to back up those smarts, someone who never promises you anything that's too good to be true, and certainly someone who never gives you that weird feeling in the pit of your stomach. Here are some of the ways that I have connected with people looking for financial guidance. First off, I nicknamed Jerome Powell Fed Daddy to explain rates lowering. Fed Daddy just announced we're lowering interest rates, and a lot of people don't even know what that means, much less what it means for them. Translating headlines into action items. The federal government didn't clock in today, but I did. So here's how the government shutdown is going to impact you and your wallet. And even breaking down how celebs like Kendrick Lamar get rich and stay rich. Kendrick Lamar's family dancing in the Not Like Us music video wasn't just a clap back. It was a genius investment. When you understand the language, you understand what matters. And the response to turning finance into fun-nance has been incredible. And this leads us into our second point. While it's on financial educators to meet the next generation where and how they already live, it's on the next generation to build their own financial community. For years, we have been told talking about money is rude, tacky, taboo. But the last time I checked, Bob and Steve seem to have no problem trading investment tips. As they're teeing off at hole three. It turns out it's really only a faux pas when we do it. It's time to change that.

I, like so many young people, clock in daily for a full shift at the looking at my phone factory. And whether you spend all of your time scrolling TikTok or reading Reddit threads, it's clear. Having conversations around money takes the power away from the people up top and gives it back to us. The internet has led to the creation of spaces like Fishbowl and Glassdoor, where people can share true, real numbers, honest struggles, and genuine victories without shame or judgment. And frankly, many of these conversations are still too raw to be had IRL. This online anonymity is empowering people to work together with their digital accountability buddies to make smarter financial choices. And my hope is that as this generation gets more comfortable creating community around money talk, the generation after us, they're going to grow up seeing money discussed so openly and authentically that they will enter adulthood with a level of financial confidence that their parents could have only dreamed of. And speaking of the future, you've probably heard the phrase, modern problems require modern solutions. It's never been more true. If I'm not getting a pension like my dad, and I can't make a household's ends meet on one income like my dad, and I certainly don't plan on working the same job for 40 years like my dad, why am I taking my dad's financial advice or worse, using my dad's financial advisor? Sorry, dad. Robo-advisors are making sophisticated investment strategies accessible to everyone. Online banks are offering competitive rates without the burden of the overhead of brick-and-mortar branches, and innovative apps are turning complex financial tasks into simple, actionable things that you can do from the palm of your hand.

These new platforms are just as regulated and licensed, and more often than not, they offer lower fees. And it's not just startup hubs or VCs that are taking notice. Creators and educators are now turning into founders. For my story, what started as just content has turned into an app powered by AI working in conjunction with certified human experts to provide guidance in plain English like a friend, and more importantly, continues to educate first and foremost. New-age financial brands aren't just a replacement for traditional financial services. They're purpose-built for the way we live now, designed to help you save smarter, invest easier, and build wealth faster than ever before. The future of finance isn't coming. It's already here, and it's working for us. So to wrap us up, a decade has passed since my horrific bar tab incident. And I so desperately wish I could go back in time and provide past Vivian with some of the solutions available to today Vivian now. This shift towards financial accessibility isn't just changing individual lives. It's building an ecosystem where everyone has a fair shot at prosperity. And my dream is that a decade from now, the evolution in financial education will mean there are fewer declined credit cards at bar night, a shrinking wealth gap, and a financial future that is brighter than ever. Thank you.

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And now a conversation between Vivian Tu and TED Talks Daily host, Elise Hu.

All right. Congrats on the talk. Thank you so much. How are you feeling? You just got off the stage. I mean, honestly, it feels like every ounce of cortisol is just leaving my body right now. Thank goodness. Yeah, if I'm honest, I was pretty nervous for this. And I don't normally get nervous when public speaking. But I think it's because normally when I keynote, I have 45 to 60 minutes. But for this, you have to keep it so tight, eight minutes, and just get everything you need to say out in that time. Right. Did you feel like you got everything out? Is there anything you want to add? I left it all out on the field. Okay. So I feel really good about it. Love to hear that. Love to hear that. All right. Well, you use your own story as a weigh-in, essentially arguing that you have become the financial advisor that you really needed when you started out. Where do we start if we've never gotten any financial education, which is most of

Yeah. I mean, listen, I always joke when people are like, oh, I want to be rich. Like, how do I get rich? I say you have to strip. And then everyone's very, very interested all of a sudden. But STRIP is just an acronym. It stands for savings. I usually recommend anywhere between three to six months to six to 12 months, depending on if you're single versus head of a household. And you would put it into a high yield savings account to make sure you're earning as much interest as possible. T, total debt. You rank your debt from highest to lowest interest rate. You make the minimum payment across everything. And then any additional debt paid on funds you would put towards the debt with the highest interest rate. R is retirement. So, you know, I think that the government treats us like we're babies. When they don't want you to do something, they'll slap you on the wrist. And when they do want you to do something, it's like a little piece of candy on a string with a stick. And so what I encourage people to do is get that piece of candy. And that piece of candy is tax advantages. You get to pay fewer taxes. It's totally legal by taking advantage of retirement accounts like 401ks, 403bs, TSPs, whatever you do for work. Then also individual retirement accounts, IRAs, you have the traditional or the Roth variety, but let's get those tax bennies. Tax bennies are amazing, but it's not just enough to have these accounts. You have to I invest those dollars. So instead of just putting cash into that 401k or cash into your IRA, You actually have to then go buy stuff. So what I recommend for people who are really, really new to this is just get a robo-advisor. You can search best robo-advisor 2025, and there will be a lot of options that come up. Play around. See which one has an interface that you feel comfortable with. And you take a quick quiz about your money goals, and they will then spit out a perfectly diversified portfolio for you. I mean, how do we not love technology, right? And then last but not least, P. You got to make a plan. You do not get to ride off into the sunset and do a happily ever after if you don't know what that looks like. For some people, that's retiring at 35 in an Airstream and never buying shoes again. That's not me. Let's just say that. That's not me. For me, I have a more traditional retirement. I'm happy to retire closer to 60, 65, but I want to have a vacation home. I want to be able to help put my kids through school. I want to be able to have a chubby English bulldog named Pickles that, you know, has to go to the vet and you have to pay for that. So picture your perfect life and then build backwards from it.

Do you feel like, and I know you've written a lot about how the system or the structures that we live in basically keep the rich rich, if not make them richer and then make the poor poorer. How is financial literacy tied into potentially, for individuals anyway, lessening the wealth gap? Because these are kind of systemic problems that individuals are having to live in.

if you do not acknowledge that there are systemic biases, systemic unfairnesses that are impacting certain communities and making it harder for them to grow wealth, you're delusional. I really do believe that. But when we talk about generational wealth, it's not just the dollars being passed down. If your rich uncle set up a trust fund for you and had a great career and owned a firm and did all of those things, it's not just wealth. It's knowledge. They already paved that road, and you get to walk on it very simply. They also pass down the, hey, don't forget, you have to use this tax loophole, or, hey, don't forget that you have this opportunity available to you to put extra money into your retirement account between these years, between this age. You know things that other people don't know.

There is huge distrust because of this wealth gap. in a lot of institutions right now, in banks, in systems. What do you advise folks who've kind of lost trust in the systems about keeping their money inside banks and investing?

So listen, I think a healthy dose of skepticism is healthy. Exactly that. But I also think saying, hey, I'm not going to participate in the financial system at all. I'm going to keep my money under a mattress is doing you no favors, right? The financial system as it currently stands is the devil that we know. And you have to play ball, unfortunately. But that means choosing the best bank that's going to give you the best interest rate on your savings account. It means when you're getting a mortgage, going to every single bank that you have ever had a relationship with in your entire life and pitting them against each other to make them enemies and a race to the bottom to get you the best rate. It means leveraging the system as it currently exists to give you the best outcome. Because if you don't participate, inflation is going to eat away at your money anyway. You're not going to get to grow. You're not going to get to participate. So while I get it, it's like, hey, if I invest, maybe I'm putting my money towards things that I don't necessarily believe in. Sure. But use that money, make that money, and then donate that money to causes you do care about. Because you're saying that if you do leave the money under the mattress, it's losing value. You get nothing. Your community gets... nothing. And there are no benefits to be had. We have to make sure that the money is going into the pockets of the people we believe in, the communities we care about. And frankly, that oftentimes is communities of color, women, marginalized groups like the LGBTQ community, immigrants, people who grew up low income. Like when we give those people opportunities, they typically pay it forward and that money stays within their communities.

Speaking of marginalized groups, women who haven't been educated in finance, people of color, other marginalized groups. Is your advice any different or more tailored to ones that have been left out of the financial system?

Yeah. I mean, that's my entire brand. I joke and I call my BFFs the leftovers. It's the people who have been left over because for so long, financial services has catered to one specific audience, and that person was old, they were white, and they were male. And I think if we don't acknowledge those discrepancies, those unfairnesses, we're doing a disservice to those people, right? It's been shown that when Black families go in to get mortgages, more often than not, they get a worse rate than the exact same couple held equal had they been white. It has been shown that women only apply to jobs when they are already hitting more than what that job requires. Whereas any guy would look at this job description, hit three out of 10 bullet points and be like, who's better for this job than me? I got this. And so I think I do need to speak to those communities because the leftovers are actually the global majority, but we don't

address them as such. Absolutely. A lot of folks are treading water right now. It takes money to save money. You've lived paycheck to paycheck before. What do you say to folks who are struggling and feel like they have nothing left to save.

Listen, I do not sit here and pretend like you can save your way out of a paycheck-to-paycheck lifestyle. I am very, very clear about this. It's going to suck for quite some time. You are going to have to either somehow manage to get paid more at your current job. So that does require a little bit of negotiation. That's probably the easiest route. You're either going to have to, for a temporary period of time, put yourself in a position of discomfort. So that means picking up a side hustle, picking up another job. I'm not saying this is all right. I'm saying this is the reality. You're likely going to have to cut back on discretionary purchases. You're going to have to cut back on, frankly, necessity purchases or opt for a lower quality of life. But my true belief is that if you're doing all of those things and you are in a position that you can say even just a little bit to get yourself that cushion, that will change your mindset entirely. Because when you don't have anything to fall back on, you make decisions out of a place of scarcity. You make decisions because you have to. But when you have a parachute, no matter how big or small, you can make the right decision and not the right now decision.

Love that. You talked about how we really need to change the language that we use. I listened to you talk about like retirement and all of these names for the financial products for retirement. Right. What a joke, right? Why are they doing that? I couldn't possibly define them all for you. And you said, when you understand what the language is, you understand what matters. Yeah. And how financial advisors really need to pivot for the reality of what young people need now. What do you mean by that? Okay. So imagine this. You hire a financial

advisor. They're like, okay, come into our brick and mortar office, bring all of your statements. We'll take a look at them to get, I don't want to do that. First off, I don't even like to call to make an appointment with my manicurist. Okay. I'm hoping that they have an online booking system.

Also, I would have to print out all my statements.

Like print them. Where am I supposed to get a printer? Like first off, like I don't work a corporate job anymore. I can't just steal my company's resources and print on the company printer. So I make this joke, But I do think it's so outdated. What other thing do you have to do in person like that? Like, when's the last time you walked into a bank branch?

Can't remember.

Can't remember, right? Because so much of our life now is done digitally when everything else in our life has been streamlined. We're going to want this streamlined too.

What is the balance for you between growing individual wealth and giving?

I think balance is the perfect word for it. my opinion is you are better off building your own financial foundation and being selfish for a temporary period of time so that you can make bigger gifts and donations later on so hear me out a big conversation this comes up in is in immigrant families so many first gen oldest daughter like such a trope but like the expectation is that you are your parents retirement plan and So the thing is, is like when you are the first person in your family.

to maybe graduate college. Maybe you saw your family make a ton of sacrifices for you to be the first person who graduated from college. And then you get the quote unquote fancy job. Maybe you come from a background where your parents worked blue collar work and now you have a corporate job, you get benefits. Maybe you're the first person in your family to make a six figure income. Maybe you're the first person in your family to own a home. Everybody's looking at you like entourage. Like we're all coming up, right? But the problem is you have to have your own emergency fund. You have to pay it on your own debt. You have to start saving for your own retirement. You have to start investing on your own. You have to have a plan of what your happily ever after is. If you don't have that, you are not in a position to be giving or taking care of other people. Once you do have that, though, I always say, you never loan. You'll only gift. And you can set a budget for how much you want to give to family, how much you want to give to philanthropic causes, how much you want to just do. And for me, that has changed over the course of my lifetime. When I was working on Wall Street at that first job, I would give, you know, $50 here, $100 there to charitable causes, mostly because they were hosting galas and I wanted to attend and drink the free liquor. As you can tell, a lot of my early 20s was just me drinking at bars. Then as I became more senior in my career, when I moved over into the media world and I was very comfortable with how much money I was making, I would make one large donation a year to a philanthropic cause that I care about, St. Jude Children's Research Hospital. And then now that I'm in a really good position, I own my own business, I know where the money's coming from, I feel very, very stable. Not only do I give every year a lump sum to a number of causes, shout out St. Jude's, but also shout out like Apex for Youth, which is supporting AAPI youth in New York City. Like I have a statement in my will of a portion, a percentage of my total assets will be passed on to charitable causes when I pass. Oh, that's a great idea. And that will never change. My kids are not getting all of my money. Let me be entirely clear. I am going to give them every possible advantage. They are going to be so incredibly privileged in a way that I was not. But generational wealth, like I said earlier, is not just cash. It is knowledge. I will be teaching my children. They are going to have to fend for themselves. The idea of spoiling my kids rotten to a point where they are not able to build a life that they can be proud of on their own. That's me stealing their confidence. That's me stealing their agency. And I would never want to do that as a parent. Can you tell us a little bit more about your new tech startup? Yes. Okay. So you can check it out at AskDolly.com. And how do you spell Dolly? D-O-L-L-Y. It's like Dolly Parton. Dolly Parton, but it's really short for a dollar. So Ask Dolly. And the reason why I'm so proud of this is basically as my platform started to grow and grow and grow, I would get thousands of DMs a day. Like to the point where it was just like completely untenable to actually respond to everybody. And all of these questions were so heartfelt. and people would like pour their entire soul into an Instagram DM. And I'm like, wow, you're giving me like a lot of personal details.

And I feel bad that this is going to sit unread, unresponded to. It's not nice. And I just experienced this downstairs as I was signing copies of my book and meeting people here at TED Next. They want to get my perspective. I want to be able to respond to my audience. I want to build that community. And I was like, okay, so how can I make sure that I'm helping people actually get their questions answered with Ask Dolly? you're going to be able to ask your financial questions. You're going to get that financial knowledge on demand. And not only is it going to be better than just a Google search or whatever, it's going to be in my tone. It's going to be explained in an analogy that you are probably already comfortable and familiar with. And then if you ask a question that is too nuanced, too one-on-one, requires more digging, requires more knowledge from you and to give to me, will actually be able to connect you with a live human CFP who is very legally licensed to give you that financial advice. Because I believe that everybody should be able to have access to this. Right now, as it stands, to get a financial advisor, more often than not, you have to have a six-figure net worth from jump. They want clients with a lot of money. But you know when I really could have used that advice? When I was 22 and my credit card was declining. And so I think, for me, it is so important to get in at the ground floor to help people when they need it most because that is really where the difference is made. It's not the difference between getting you from $1 million to $5 million. It's the difference between getting you from $10 in your checking account to $1,000. You are going to feel that. Amazing. Vivian, thank you so much. Of course. Thank you so much for having me.

that's it for today ted business is part of the ted audio collective this episode was produced by hannah kingsley ma edited by alejandra salazar and fact-checked by julia dickerson special thanks to maria ladias farah de grunge daniela balarezo kansakasangmani Vaughn and Roxanne Hilash. I'm Madhupa Akinola. Thanks for listening.

seven days a week to assist with your banking needs. Yep, even on weekends, it's pretty much all he talks about, in a good way. What's in your wallet? Terms apply. See CapitalOne.com slash bank. Capital One N.A. member FDIC. Hi there, it's Adam Grant from Ted's Rethinking

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